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Chucky’s 1966 Mustang rebuild

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67 ski nat View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 67 ski nat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-02-2020 at 4:54pm
Yep 10-17 is in the manual I was looking at online, 71c on tag.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-02-2020 at 5:47pm
Originally posted by 67 ski nat 67 ski nat wrote:

Yep 10-17 is in the manual I was looking at online, 71c on tag.


Check out the manual in the link

link

It's from a little known secret internet spot called the CCF reference section

It'll tell you that your 71C has 5 inner clutch plates and 4 outer clutch plates for Forward and it has 1 reverse pressure plate and 1 reverse clutch plate. The reverse clutch plate on some is fiber and on some it's metallic.

The fiber break easier and reverse no longer works when that happens

The ALTO kit Chucky bought has a metallic plate (that's a good thing)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kristof Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-04-2020 at 2:49pm
Originally posted by 63 Skier 63 Skier wrote:

Your shop is way too clean. I don't trust you ......


- Gun control means: using BOTH hands!
- Money doesn't make one happy, but when it rains cats and dogs, it's still better to cry in a Porsche than on a bicycle...

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chucky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-09-2020 at 3:31am
Too clean, that’s funny. I recently completely “finished” the garage (tape, mud, prime, paint). Last winter, I was knee-deep in the Belair transmission. I had a slight problem with 3rd gear. Currently, I’m waiting for a couple of parts to arrive so I can button up the Velvet drive.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-09-2020 at 9:00pm
Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:

Originally posted by 67 ski nat 67 ski nat wrote:

Yep 10-17 is in the manual I was looking at online, 71c on tag.


Check out the manual in the link

link

It's from a little known secret internet spot called the CCF reference section

It'll tell you that your 71C has 5 inner clutch plates and 4 outer clutch plates for Forward and it has 1 reverse pressure plate and 1 reverse clutch plate. The reverse clutch plate on some is fiber and on some it's metallic.

The fiber break easier and reverse no longer works when that happens

The ALTO kit Chucky bought has a metallic plate (that's a good thing)


A little addition to this thread is the B/W manual in the link below.

It's a later version of what's in the CCF reference section with a few extra pages in the back.

One of those pages talks about reverse clutch plate combinations and another has info on the infamous "velvet dipstick" Most people on CCF would be interested in the RED velvet Dipstick

link
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chucky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-15-2020 at 3:50pm
I have the 70C trans, so your results may vary. I replaced the fiber reverse clutch with 2 bronze’s (separated by 1 steel). The forward clutch pack and all gaskets and seals are now new. It really wasn’t very difficult to “rebuild”. I never needed a press (maybe you do with a 71C?). But, I can’t stress enough the importance of a proper snap ring pliers.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chucky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-15-2020 at 3:57pm
My project came with the bellhousing to connect to a 302. If anyone needs a 289 bellhousing, let me know. Primer is drying now...Thanks to KENO for being a good resource. Soon, I’ll be mounting the engine / trans in the boat!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Faceplant Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-15-2020 at 9:08pm
Curious to amount of time involved for trans rebuild ?
Feels like I am hanging 10 but in reality - probably hanging 6.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chucky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-15-2020 at 10:15pm
I’d say 3-4 sessions of 4 or so hours each. So 12-16 hours max. Of course I could do it quicker, now that I’ve already done it. I think it would be possible to do it in 1 weekend, but I spaced it over 3 weekends. Internally, mine was very clean. I suspect it still worked, but I had no way of knowing. The front seal was worn looking, compared to the new one. I’m glad I decided to rebuild it. The trickiest part for me was rebuilding the forward hydraulic actuator. There’s an internal o-ring and a external flat cut o-ring. After replacing those o-rings, it was difficult to put the 2 pieces of that component back together. They fit very tightly together and the flat cut o-ring nearly got “pinched” every time I tried to put the parts back together. Slow, even pressure and patience was required on that part. The reverse hydraulic actuator assembly (similar o-rings) went back together easily. I’ll admit, I was a bit nervous, but it was actually not bad at all. A nice table, 2 rolls of paper towels, 2 cans of brake parts cleaner, a 1.5” socket, a nice pair of snap ring pliers and some basic hand tools and you should be good to go.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chucky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-15-2020 at 10:23pm
Instead of soaking my clutches in ATF, I just used a small paint brush and brushed on a nice coating of trans fluid to all sides of the bronze clutches. I cleaned the steels with brake parts cleaner / paper towels before brushing them with trans fluid too. They will be just fine and they will get soaked later when I fill and further prep the transmission.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chucky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-16-2020 at 12:49pm
Rustoleum “Royal Blue”. Looks good to me. Edit to add “before” picture.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 67 ski nat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-16-2020 at 1:37pm
Thanks for your updates. Feeling better bout tackling mine
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-16-2020 at 3:44pm
Chucky mentioned a nice set of snap ring pliers and to go along with them a good pair of lock ring pliers come in handy on one particular lock ring.

They make life easier without having to invent any new swear words along the way   

So.........snap ring pliers for snap rings and lock ring pliers for a lock ring

Here's a link to one example, you can spend more or you can spend less

link

Here's a picture of what the ends look like on a typical pair

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chucky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-16-2020 at 6:10pm
!!!YES!!! You will NOT get that one lock ring off (without destroying it) without pliers similar to what KENO shows above. I should have been more clear on that. On a different note...Could someone please post a picture, or describe really well about where and or how this part is mounted? I know it’s part of the steering system. I know it goes with the clamping block. But, I don’t know what it bolts to??? Remember, I didn’t take this boat apart. Thanks!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-16-2020 at 6:54pm
Originally posted by Chucky Chucky wrote:

!!!YES!!! You will NOT get that one lock ring off (without destroying it) without pliers similar to what KENO shows above. I should have been more clear on that. On a different note...Could someone please post a picture, or describe really well about where and or how this part is mounted? I know it’s part of the steering system. I know it goes with the clamping block. But, I don’t know what it bolts to??? Remember, I didn’t take this boat apart. Thanks!


Go to the linked thread, 4th picture down and you'll see it bolted to the drivers side stringer with the clamp block bolted to it

And further on down page 1 , you'll see another picture of it.

link

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-16-2020 at 6:59pm
Not the same era hull but the ball is the attachment for the steering cable torque tube at the aft end.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote 67 ski nat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-17-2020 at 10:34am
The ball is hiding (sandwiched ) under the four bolt and plate. And the shaft is in that mounting block extension
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-17-2020 at 11:13am
This is the same set up as you have.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chucky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-21-2020 at 5:31pm
I had today off, so I installed the prop strut and the rudder support housing. The bolts on the strut are currently upside down. I needed to do it that way, because I’m working alone. Once the sealer sets up, I will flip and seal the bolts. I now notice the mark on the stringer that locates the clamping block mounting ball stud.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chucky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-21-2020 at 5:35pm
This project came with these two types of 3/16 shaft packing material - which one should I use on the prop shaft stuffing box? And how about the rudder packing?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chucky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-21-2020 at 5:42pm
One part that came with this project is this bearing. THIS MIGHT NOT EVEN BE FOR THIS BOAT??? Anybody know if it is? I believe the one on the left is used and on the right is the new replacement. I googled the p/n (6202RS-10) but still am not sure of it’s application. Any help appreciated!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-21-2020 at 5:50pm
Looks like the clamp block could move aft a bit from where it’s marked, judging by Bruce’s maxed out adjustment. That was a common issue on the 71+ 16’ hull.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote 67 ski nat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-22-2020 at 5:48am
My prop shaft stuff box took 1/4” flax rope and rudder used 3/16”
I used regular flax , not the Teflon black
I’m curious about second opinion though too
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-22-2020 at 1:48pm
Originally posted by Chucky Chucky wrote:

One part that came with this project is this bearing. THIS MIGHT NOT EVEN BE FOR THIS BOAT??? Anybody know if it is? I believe the one on the left is used and on the right is the new replacement. I googled the p/n (6202RS-10) but still am not sure of it’s application. Any help appreciated!


Chucky

I checked with this guy and he says it fits a lot of Sherwood raw water pumps





You can find that bearing with a 15 mm inside diameter or with a 5/8 inch inside diameter The 10 on the end should mean it's a 5/8 ID

If the one you have has a 5/8 inch ID, 35 mm OD and 11 mm depth, like Carnac said, it fits a lot of Sherwood pumps.

Here's a picture I took of an old and new bearing from a Sherwood G21 pump in front of the pump bearing housing. Plenty of others use the same bearings.

The original Sherwood bearings in this pump were NTN SC0228LU





PS I can't vouch for the accuracy of the Sherwood part listings in their catalogs, but this is the bearing size that comes in a major overhaul kit and it fits just right.

Also Carnac is just plain amazed that 67 SkiNat can tell from your pictures what kind of packing each of those are just from the color of the packing

Have you already measured to verify that 3/16 is what fits the shaft and the rudder?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chucky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-22-2020 at 3:09pm
“Liking” the bearing info...Thanks! My rudder and prop shaft stuffing boxes match each other dimensionally. I’ve read some conflicting info on which size packing to use. I tried the 2 drill bit method and the 1/4” bits don’t fit, while the 3/16” bits fit, they are a little “loose”. When I caliper measure the “thickness” of the male thread portion, it is 1/4” thick. I ended up fitting 3 rings of my 3/16” material into the female nut and assembled the stuffing box onto some 1” diameter stock that I had laying around. I tightened the assembly very tight to “smash” the packing material, and then loosened it up a bit. I feel like the 3/16” would seal, but I have nothing to compare it to. I feel like it’s supposed to be 1/4”. This chart I found says 1/4” for 1” shafts...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-22-2020 at 3:16pm
Originally posted by Chucky Chucky wrote:

I tightened the assembly very tight to “smash” the packing material, and then loosened it up a bit.

You may have a problem so, when you get the boat in the water, make sure the prop shaft gland doesn't run hot. I have NEVER found that packing, once compressed with loosen up. The worst would be having to do a re pack. On the rudder, it doesn't matter since it's not constantly rotating and you what it tight.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chucky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-22-2020 at 4:43pm
Thanks gents. After more measuring, I went ahead and ordered some 1/4” packing material.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-23-2020 at 9:22am
Originally posted by Chucky Chucky wrote:

Thanks gents. After more measuring, I went ahead and ordered some 1/4” packing material.


Hopefully you have enough 3/16 still around "just in case"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote 67 ski nat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-23-2020 at 11:52am
KENO, I might owe you a hamburger
Chunky flip packages over let see
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote MrMcD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-23-2020 at 3:36pm
Chucky, using the same logic you did I installed my new shaft packing and tightened it on install to SEAT it and then backed off for the water test. Bad idea. When I went on the water to do the final adjustments on the packing shaft boat running on the water it would not leak at all, zero drips of water to lubricate my prop shaft it got hot right away even though I had the packing nut totally loose. Once packed it pretty much stays packed.
I had extra packing with me so I dug out the just installed packing and re did the install.
This time installed loose only brought the nut down with my hand and did not tighten it,   Now still on the lake we ran the boat while watching the packing nut, it stayed cool and was dripping a lot.   I slowly tightened the nut. Each time I tightened a little we ran the boat at least a mile at 35 mph to see if it heated up and then when shut off checked for any dripping.   A slow drip at speed kept the nut cool. If you tighten any more the water lubrication shuts off and the nut starts heating up, as it heats up it grows and shuts off even more water so it gets even hotter.   
We played on the water for about an hour till I was comfortable that the nut stayed cool while driving but did not drip while parked. That was 5 years ago, I have not adjusted it since but I think it is time to check it again this year.
If there is a better way to properly set the packing nut I would love to know it. This method works but at least in my case it took some trial and error to get it right.
If memory serves correctly you are looking for 6-10 drips per minute while in gear motoring on the water. When adjusted to this amount your nut running may get a little warm but never hot while running, and parked you have no leak at all.
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