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db electrical alternator

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wakeboardin2k4 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wakeboardin2k4 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: db electrical alternator
    Posted: February-18-2008 at 3:36pm
I found a company called db electrical on ebay that sells alternators for a much lower price that a lot of other places. Anyone have any experience with them?

100amp alternator for 70 dollars. Seems like one of those too good to be true deals

Thanks Eric
"I'm planning to bring my girl that rides on a trailer with me and leave my girl that complains about camping at home"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-18-2008 at 3:38pm
if it's too good then odd's are it's a POS and a half ass rebuilt alternator, beside I think I could get a AC/Delco rebuilded cheaper than that anyway.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wakeboardin2k4 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-18-2008 at 3:41pm
In that case could you point me in the correct direction for a good rebuild kit?
"I'm planning to bring my girl that rides on a trailer with me and leave my girl that complains about camping at home"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-18-2008 at 4:38pm
Sorry don't get the same discount for other people, but keep looking, E-bay's not alway's the cheapist place.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bremsen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-18-2008 at 7:31pm
I have not heard anything bad about DB and would purchase from them again. I bought the 55A Mando since its more of a direct replacement (identical to the one skidim sells) for the PCM ford.

The reason that one is so cheap is b/c it's a 1-wire 10SI delco, the SBC of Alternators. Even 79 says "I could get a AC/Delco rebuilded cheaper". It will probably require some re-wiring of the electrical system in addition to increasing wire gauge though. Its not exactly a plug/play.

Oh and here is a recent thread where db defends their products against blind judgements (ie cheap and/or import).
http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/3183/544973.html

Take it for what its worth.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-18-2008 at 8:59pm
I normally try not to post rebuilders unless they've proven to me that they do quality work, this guy has a clean organized shop and is very professional, (no trees around anywhere) but he's rebuilt marine starters and altenators for $65.00, ive never ever had a problem with his work. his rebuilds come back to me like new including all new studs, nuts and washers......just passing on info
Cuyahoga Rebuilders Inc. -Cleveland-
5111 Brookpark Rd.
Parma, Ohio 44134
216-635-0659
216-635-0667 fax
"the things you own will start to own you"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-19-2008 at 11:31am
Originally posted by Bremsen Bremsen wrote:

It will probably require some re-wiring of the electrical system in addition to increasing wire gauge though. Its not exactly a plug/play.


no it doesn't have to modified and if you ever tried it's extremely difficult due to the way it is manufactured.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dans Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-19-2008 at 6:00pm
DB is a great place. I highly recommend them. They have new alternators also. I have a high output 200 amp new ( not refurb) DB electric alt in my 89 c1500 350 motor.I use it to power my competition 2000 watt 1ohm sub woofer amp.It has performed flawless & I punish it every day. Lots of guys in the competition car audio scene use DB electrical & have no issues. Just make sure you do the "big three wire upgrade" if your pushing a 200 amp alt.Google "big 3 upgrade" & find lots of install tips on the wire upgrades needed.O gauge alternator power wire to battery, O gauge ground wires for battery & motor .Db electrical Ebay store is the best deals & there alts have a no questions asked warranty.If I get one for my boat I'm gonna use them.I will go with something smaller than the 200 amp though. Dan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bremsen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-19-2008 at 6:46pm
Originally posted by 79nautique 79nautique wrote:

no it doesn't have to modified and if you ever tried it's extremely difficult due to the way it is manufactured.


I was referring to the boat's electrical system. 3-wire to 1-wire and re-wiring the boat to handle 100 amps (breaker, wire gauge, etc).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-19-2008 at 7:02pm
I bought one from them also after my local rebuilder could'nt be bothered with my Prestolite.Fast shipping and looks to be a good one.I have now found someone that fixed my Prestolite,so thats going back on to keep Pete happy
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 7:55am
marine grade, doubt it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dans Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 8:32am
At DB you can get several marine grade alternators new & rebuilt. They can even make one to your specs if in a reasonable amp output.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wakeboardin2k4 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 12:48pm
So I bit the bullet and ordered a 100 amp 3 wire alternator from DB. Now comes the rewire of the current wires to a larger gauge. I will do a search for posts about that. If anyone knows a good one off hand could you post it?
"I'm planning to bring my girl that rides on a trailer with me and leave my girl that complains about camping at home"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 12:56pm
I do leave it alone before you screw it up. there's no need to change anything just because you are now using a 100A alternator.

Are you going to be hooking the amp to the alternator? I hope not it should go directly to the battery. Let all of the idiots start talking about changing this changing that it's all ********* and not needed.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 1:05pm
Originally posted by 79nautique 79nautique wrote:

there's no need to change anything just because you are now using a 100A alternator.

Wrong. The wire running from the alt to the dash isnt fused. Thats because the 10awg factory wire can handle the full output of the stock alternator (up to 55A). That wire should be fused at the alt under its max current rating (~50A), or replaced with a wire large enough to handle the full output rating of the new alt (preferably 4awg).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 1:18pm
Originally posted by TRBenj TRBenj wrote:

Originally posted by 79nautique 79nautique wrote:

there's no need to change anything just because you are now using a 100A alternator.

Wrong. The wire running from the alt to the dash isnt fused. Thats because the 10awg factory wire can handle the full output of the stock alternator (up to 55A). That wire should be fused at the alt under its max current rating (~50A), or replaced with a wire large enough to handle the full output rating of the new alt (preferably 4awg).


wrong Timmy, it's way over kill on the 4 awg wire.

So let me word it a litle different. Delt with Alt design once or twice and I can tell you for a fact the wire spec never change didn't matter if it was 65A or 100A 10si or 12si the connector on the back and the wire attached to it where exactly the same. your still charging the battery at the same rate the dash gagues are still going to draw the same amount of current the radio is going to draw the same amount of current nothing changes so there is no need to change wire size or the curcuit breaker for that matter.

You guys are not comparing apples to apples, you got one battery maybe two big deal. If you have a hugh bank of batteries like some of the stereo show vehicles do then ********* yea you better upgrade the wire as now you are feeding 20 amps of current to 20 batteries so you need the current to charge them but you've got two ********* batteries max in a ski boat so waiste your money and bullsh*t your self if you want there is no ********* reason to Change the gauge of wire from the 10 awg it all ready is.

don't think that just because I'm installing an amp, I've got to change the alternator, I've got to change the gauge of wire on everything.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 1:33pm
Originally posted by 79nautique 79nautique wrote:


wrong Timmy, it's way over kill on the 4 awg wire.

So let me word it a litle different. Delt with Alt design once or twice and I can tell you for a fact the wire spec never change didn't matter if it was 65A or 100A 10si or 12si the connector on the back and the wire attached to it where exactly the same. your still charging the battery at the same rate the dash gagues are still going to draw the same amount of current the radio is going to draw the same amount of current nothing changes so there is no need to change wire size or the curcuit breaker for that matter.

You guys are not comparing apples to apples, you got one battery maybe two big deal. If you have a hugh bank of batteries like some of the stereo show vehicles do then f**k yea you better upgrade the wire as now you are feeding 20 amps of current to 20 batteries so you need the current to charge them but you've got two batteries max in a ski boat so waiste your money if you want there is no reason to Change the gauge of wire from the 10 awg it all ready is.


4awg is overkill, youre right. 6awg is capable of handling 100A, but theres not much head room- and 4awg wire is more common and should be less expensive, hence my recommendation.

Youre missing the point, Chris. Im not talking about the alt-batt charging loop. Youre right that the dash will draw no more current, but by upgrading the alt and not the wire running to the dash, what happens if the wire shorts somewhere before the 20A breaker at the dash? You have the potential to send a full 100A through a wire only rated for 55A. Thats how fires start. Hence, the need for a wire that can handle 100A or a fuse/breaker below the wire's current rating (55A).

I forgot that that you'll need to replace or add another engine circuit breaker. Otherwise you'll trip it every time the battery draws more current than the stock breaker will allow.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 1:49pm
Since your so up on battery charging does a battery charge fast at -20F, 45F or 75F?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 2:18pm
Originally posted by 79nautique 79nautique wrote:

the alternator will not charge the battery any faster or with a higher current, you start pumping more current to the battery then all your going to do is boil the electrolite and gas out the battery.

Are you implying that there is never any need for a higher output alternator?

Obviously an alt will only supply the amount of current being drawn from it. Im assuming that if one is upgrading the alt, theres a reason for it. That is, there are high-load systems on the boat that need to be powered. An alt with a higher current output will better serve to power those loads and/or recharge the batteries those loads are wired to.

By not changing any of the existing wiring when switching to an alt with a higher output current, you do 2 things that are undesirable:

1)You effectively limit the charging capabilities of the new alt to the rating of the engine breaker.

2)You increase the risk of melting the wire running to the dash and starting a fire.

Failing to address the first issue negates any improvement with the new alt. Failing to address the second issue increases the chances of burning your boat to the waterline.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 2:31pm
Tim, I feel your statement on a 100amp alternators potential to produce the 100 amps is right on the money. I too would up size wire plus add fusing/breakers.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 2:44pm
you two do not understand the inner workings of an alternator. The way you talk is the battery creates load on the electrical system which it doesn't, the number of accesories in use at one time is what creates the load on the alternator not the battery. The amount of current going to the battery is controled by the recitifier bridge and is constant, if you increase the amount of current going to the battery you destroy the battery by boiling it because you are sending to much current to the battery. And since your so intune with the inner works of an alternator, what changes inside of it to create more current? The windings inside of the rotor segment is what does and they share everything else stator, regulator, diode trio, brush holder, recifier bridge are all the same. So if a 64A alternator and a 100A alternator share the exact same electroinc's how can one charge the battery more than the other? it cann't dump ass listen you are in left field talking out of your ass because you have never worked on or designed an alternator ever so why is it you would know more about it than someone that has? I wish I still had access to the drawing of the general asmblies and I could show you that a 64A 10si is exactly the same as a 100A 10si with the exception of one one part and that assembly that it goes into.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote boat dr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 3:01pm
Chris, I have stayed out of this pissing contest , so far, BUT.
On a 10 SI , merely changing the stator on a 65 amp unit will allow this unit to produce 100 amps for a short period of time.
The rotor, bridge diode,regulator and trio all stay the same.
To build a bullet proof 100 amp unit that will handle this type of heat for long will require a rewound rotor and a larger diode bank,ie to get rid of the excessive heat generated .
The 12SI will do a better job of supplying 100 plus amps strictly by its design, better air flow and larger components. It just dont fit as well as the smaller sibling into the marine confines of an engine box.....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 3:08pm
Originally posted by boat dr boat dr wrote:

On a 10 SI , merely changing the stator on a 65 amp unit will allow this unit to produce 100 amps for a short period of time.
The rotor, bridge diode,regulator and trio all stay the same.
To build a bullet proof 100 amp unit that will handle this type of heat for long will require a rewound rotor and a larger diode bank,ie to get rid of the excessive heat generated .


since you stepped in and conterdicted your self you should read what you typed and read what I said, the windings inside of the rotor segment is what changes not the stator windings, you yourself state to make a bullet proof 100A you have to change the rotor so what is it Stator or rotor that has to change? rotor does. Changing the stator does nothing on a generator, Now if it was a motor then changing the stator would make more or less power depending on how the new stator was wound but again on a motor you change the stator to change the power rating on a alternator you change the rotor to change the power rating.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 3:11pm
besides the 10si and 12si units where never design to be repairable that's why the stator leads are welded to the bridge assembly and why there is a plastic cover on the side slip ring end or SRE as it was called on the drawings and was made up of the SRE housing, bridge asm, diode trio, regulator, stator, brush holder asm and the DE or drive end contand the De housing, rotor asm and pulley.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hollywood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 3:30pm
I lost you at SRE, that is a huge sentence. Glad I peeked in here, a lot of activity over an alternator.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 3:36pm
Originally posted by Hollywood Hollywood wrote:

I lost you at SRE, that is a huge sentence. Glad I peeked in here, a lot of activity over an alternator.


I guess when it's your name on the drawing that the shop floor is using to build from, then you might have a little clue on how they are made and how they are suppose to work and what is different between a 64A unit and 100A unit in the same product line.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 3:44pm
well Here's something for you Doc, try this out you might have everything needed.

Need a boat with an alternator rating around 35-64A and that has a ampmeter in the dash.

now leave the blower on for a couple hours to draing the battery. Start the boat and watch the amp meter and record the highist reading. bet it's not over 20 amps. Now replace the alt with a 100A unit and do the same thing and 100 bucks say's you will see the same amp reading on the gauge around 20A's

So if I listen to Tim a 100A alt is going to charge a battery faster but how is that possible when they both have the same amount of current going into the battery yet the one alt has almost double the amp rating?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote boat dr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 3:44pm
Too many hours in the sun or too many Buds.
Both units are rebuildable with many thousands under my belt.
The stators are attached to the bridge diode with 10/32 screws, these also hold the regulator and the diode trio in place. That is the device that turns off the idiot light on the dash.
All the 10SI stators are wired in the delta config.The size of the winding are larger.
No Chris i was not in the think tank that did the designing, I was the one in the Alternator shop that did the rebuilding. Heat was and is the KILLER of these units, the insulators that wrap around the stator winding deteriorate and allow the stator to short to the core.
They will not allow enough cooling air thru the housing , design flaw from the engineers.
I stand by my statement as to above.....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wakeboardin2k4 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 3:46pm
In the end im going to upgrade the wire just simply so I don't burn the boat down to the waterline from over amping a small gauge wire. Plus wire is relatively cheap.

The reason for my change from a 55amp alternator to a 100amp is because I have a small system with 2 amplifiers (500 watts each), dual batteries, and 3 ballast pumps. And my old alternator couldn't keep up with that kind of load and died so I'm going with something stronger. Thanks for everyones help, now lets all buy each other a beer calm down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote boat dr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2008 at 3:47pm
Those units were rated at 65 amps not 64, and if you did design them , you knew that the stator was removeable. And yes they were repairable...........
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