Furnace rebates

pete, i talked to a couple of buddies in the hvac business and my supplier in KC where i bought my heat pump and copeland seemed to be the unanimous choice. whith that said, i have not put any effort into substantiating any of those claims with any evidence (i am not even sure what i would look for). when it comes to tecumseh compressors i will have to agree to disagree and put the subject to rest.

thatdude596, i am not a hvac expert and might not have any ground to stand on, but i have a hard time believing that volumetric effiency has no significance when picking out a compressor. in my field, vlumetric efficiency means leakage and leakage means a sloppy, horespower robbing, heat making hydraulic pump or motor.

also pete, i dont own a boat, however i am a CCF. about 3 years ago, i narrowed my boat search to a correct craft. two kids and building a new house screwed the pooch on that idea, so i am waiting patiently for the perfect boat to pop up so i can tear up the local water hole in a correct craft. thanks to CCF, when my day comes to purchase a correct craft i will be much more knowledgable than i was 3 years ago. are you a fan of anything that you dont own?

would you guys believe the Borg Warner is the best transmission out there? lol

I have to admire their passion and expertise, but you are correct, there is nothing like a trip to Green Lake to remind us all what we have in common. Only about 7 months away now . It's going to be a long winter.

There is still some heating oil use here, Some propane also, If your in town and natural gas is piped down your street it is a no brainer from a cost stand point. I remember a story a few years back about a heating oil truck going to the wrong house and filling the basement through the old disconnected filler tube, created an EPA nightmare and the house had to be demolished.

81nautique wrote: I never cease to be amazed at what we will argue about here in the slow winter months. In case know ones noticed I don't post much anymore because I don't like arguing with Friends but it happens all to often. Let it go guys, Thatdude, welcome and relax. Get out to a reunion this summer and learn that 99% of the folks here are awesome people, love boats, skiing and will always lend a helping hand to friends and strangers alike, especially the guy your having issues with now. We have such a good time as a group I urge you not to alienate yourself before you really know what this site is all about. Thanks for listening.

I know what you mean, Allen.

Do you guys use heating oil in the mid west? Until recently about 90% of Maine homes did, but people are converting like crazy. 6 years ago I was paying under a buck a gallon through a co op. I just got a little more than a half tank for $550, $2.97/gal and it hasn't even gotten really cold yet. Ouch!

given- i work for the largest hvac pipe fitting and service contractor in ohio and know what we use and buy. i talk to these guys everyday in, and out of the workday. 90% of our equipment from my prvious post is what we use. never have seen our company or anyone i know install tecumseh bud. i know many many people in the industry and never heard anything good about tecumseh. as far as pricing i highly doubt your buddy gets cheaper prices being a smaller company. i consider a small company 10-15 guys. ask your buddy if he gets all of his equipment within 1% of each other. if he says yes, hes getting fooled by the better salesman here. a tin can is often referred to a hermetically sealed unit or a lousy noisy pos. if you go back to my post i stated the tecumsehs are very noisy and sound like a tin can.(ie: cheaply made, thin walled, loud,like banging a tin can.) fyi your buddy is an idiot or you mis quoted him. he stated a copeland is a tin can,(meaning hermetically sealed in your neck of the world) and is inferior to tecumseh. well in about 2006-2007 most residential and light commercial which includes beer coolers/freezers switched to hermetically sealed units, or tin cans! why? they are disposable and cheaper. a hermetically sealed unit in balanced and sealed, and filled from the factory, no maintenence. this is cheaper for the contractor and the owner. they are less noisy 75% of the time by them wrapping them in cases or blankets, and shim the with rubber isolators on the bottom. semi heretics are still used in the larger scale of compressors due to the aspect of being able to rebuild them. were talking big money units that will last 30-50 years here. semis are heaveier more monies larger in size, and louder in gerneral. these compressors are rebuilable since the intial cost can range from 2000- 10,000. these have external motors that can be worked on and repalced. these you will find in big refrigeration systems.now that just a quick overview and lesson on hermetic-non hermetic. all companies make both sealed and non sealed. whats better, depends on the application. your not gonna put a 5000 semi hermetic compressor in a 7000 job. again tecumsehs are very loud made cheaply, and sound like a tin can. yes they can be tin cans IF they are hermetically sealed as well. apples v apples tecumsehs are inferior to the original post products. before i go the i will touch base on volumetric efficiency. basically this equates to rpms and overall power, and efficiency. this is a gray area and doesnt necessarily make the product better overall. you can get around this by using larger/smaller valves or many valves. this is a whole new discussion and really done proving my point to you cause fro mreading most of your posts, it seems like you know it all. always a mr. know it all on every forum and no matter what just likes to argue. im done cause your buddy and yourself know everything when it comes to hvac/pipefitting/service. btw- my boat is a pristine 1994 19'6 ski nautique red white n black. what did my boat have anything to do with this topic? have a good day sir.

copelands embarco danfoss climatuff are all good. 8122- your buddy is a good salesman, tecumseh are crap. they are cheaper thats why he uses them. he can make more profits even if if he has to service them. i dont know anyone, or companies in the residential or commericial aspect that uses tecumseh. most people stay away from anything made with the logo tecumseh on it. really they are loud and made cheaply. funny your buddy says they copelands are a tin can, he has it backwards my friend. sure any compressor can go bad within a year, or even weeks. thats just like anything made in this world, there is no 100% perfect product...but then again wtf do i know.

OverMyHead wrote: 67425ks wrote: overmyhead p.s. my wife is from clarkfield minnesota. i have experienced a little bit of your winters and decided i dont have what it takes to survive up there. I am not sure most people have what it takes, but when your stuck here you have to find it. It's mind over matter, if you don't mind it does not really matter.

I think it's more about keeping occupied with winter activities rather than sitting inside all day. I don't mind snowmobiling one bit. I actually look forward to it.

overmyhead
for what its worth, i have been told that whatever unit you pick out, make sure it has a copeland compressor. so far mine has been great, but its only 1.5 years old. also, the 2 stage in my opinion is worth the extra money.
p.s. my wife is from clarkfield minnesota. i have experienced a little bit of your winters and decided i dont have what it takes to survive up there.

8122pbrainard wrote: horkn wrote: fwiw, I used to be in the HVAC business, Thermocouples can go bad on any furnace. Tom, How long ago were you in the trade?

Too long for a college degree.

OverMyHead wrote: thatdude596 wrote: stay away from rheem. they are not crap, but they are also not a well built/designed system. look into train american standard carrier or even bryant. Duuuudddee, your majorly bumming me out, warning me about getting rheemed the night before my furnace install. I did my research and two independant consumer ratings (One was consumer reports) rated both the rheem AC and furnace as lowest for repair calls. I am not guestioning your advice, OK maybe wondering a little about your credability (your profile is pretty empty) I am wondering the basis for your opinion. Are you in the industry? A consumer with bad experience? Do you have an ex-wife that stands to inherit the rheem fortune? , I am too far in and got to good of a price to turn back now. I will cross my fingers and keep paying my sevice plus coverage after the warrenty expires.

credentials- well for starters i have been around and in the biz since i was in diapers. my grandfather is a retired tinner, all 3 uncles and old man are union tinners, including myself. all have done hundreds of residential units, installs, check ups, service calls, etc. i have two uncles who own non union companies, and have several friends that own companies as well. lets just say the credentials are over qualified. back to the facts, i dont know anyone who would install rheem systems. even if i got the units much much cheaper than the above stated, its not worth the headache. headaches being faulty equipment, bad factory support, and the dreaded service calls. are they junk, no. there is some real pos furnaces out there, like goodmans lennox, keeprites, amana,comfortmaker, ducane, etc. why i and most people i know wont use rheem is quality and craftmanship of the units. they boxes and design and cheaper, comparable to many builders grade boxes. they are louder, and noisy than most. they have a horrible blower fan that is undersized, thus prone to burning up. the pc board is not as high quality as other top end furnaces. burners are not of same gauge and as well built. really they are an inferior product of the furnaces i stated above, but again not junk. you may never have a problem, or you may get rheemed in the end. to be honest i worked with a guy who started his own union residential company on the side using rheem equipment. he no longer is in the residential game, due to a few reasons, one being the equipment and reps were not very well. again this wasnt the only deciding factor, but one of them. btw did you opt for the single stage or variable speed blower? the variable speeds are the way to go with the 95%. good luck and dont me to scare you away to much!

fwiw, I used to be in the HVAC business, and I never heard/ saw anything bad with rheem water heaters or furnaces.

I will tell you that I worked and dealt more with boilers and plumbing than furnaces, but i have gone on a few no heat calls for furnaces. Thermocouples can go bad on any furnace.

The Rheem warning goes for water heaters too.
Don't forget the credit goes for them too!

Not a deduction, that would come of your income resulting in a tax savings at the rate of your federal taxes, You get a 30 percent tax credit which comes directly off your tax bill, so if you got the full 1500 as a deduction and you were in the 15% bracket it would save you $225 off your tax bill, as a credit you get the full $1500 off your bill, provided you had 1500 worth of taxes on income to offset.

We just missed this- had to replace the AC and Furnace and ended up going with Payne HE units in 2008. Well over 5K for both (I want to say 5800) and that's with a good friend's company purchasing and installing (discounted). Still going strong with no problems. It is amazing that the exhaust is so cool that it can vent via PVC (and it draws fresh air in via a separate pipe). My "chimney" is now only used for the hot water heater.