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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote boat dr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Y Block Question
    Posted: June-29-2011 at 1:32am
Pete the 312 block is a one off, as is the crank.The compression increase is a result of the shorter deck height, and increas in bore and stroke.
Also found there are as many hidden ponies in a 292 as in a 312, over bore to .125 safely......lets see what happens come winter,
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote boat dr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-29-2011 at 1:22am
[QUOTE=Riley] I guess the next one will be red.

QUOTE]
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote boat dr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-29-2011 at 1:18am
It appears there was a new short block purchased in 1964 for this boat, original motor puked #7 rod , damaging the alum. oil pan .There is a small repair on the flange. It is indeed a 312, w/ FoMoCo std. rods and mains. There were some issues, I was told, with the older castings, so maybe this unit being new in '64 could well be in that time frame.
There are only about 40 hours on this engine,very pleased with the power and performace the 215 hp provides.
I am building a 292 to swap for the rest of the summer,this is a parts and pieces motor, a little time and we will see if it will live,

This wooden boat stuff sometimes sucks,,,,,,,,
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-28-2011 at 10:36pm
Originally posted by Riley Riley wrote:

You would think they would have all broke by now. I didn't realize 312's and 292's used the same cranks. Aren't the strokes different?

Looking at the "Y" block manual, it does look like they lengthened the stroke on the 312 from the 292 by .14" but the bore as well. We'll see what Billy comes back with as far as the info on what he used for a crank.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-28-2011 at 10:13pm
Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

Originally posted by Riley Riley wrote:

What would cause such a failure. Too much power for an old crank?

There are "Y"'s running with blowers without problems but, according to John, there was a era when Mercury {who was building the 292's at the time} did have casting problems. Billy correct me if I'm wrong but didn't you tell me you used a 292 crank that did come from the Mercury crank problem era?


You would think they would have all broke by now. I didn't realize 312's and 292's used the same cranks. Aren't the strokes different?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-28-2011 at 9:51pm
Originally posted by Riley Riley wrote:

What would cause such a failure. Too much power for an old crank?

There are "Y"'s running with blowers without problems but, according to John, there was a era when Mercury {who was building the 292's at the time} did have casting problems. Billy correct me if I'm wrong but didn't you tell me you used a 292 crank that did come from the Mercury crank problem era?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-28-2011 at 9:17pm
I guess the next one will be red.

What would cause such a failure. Too much power for an old crank?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-28-2011 at 9:00pm
I just finished a very lengthy conversation with Billy. After he consulted with John Mummert who is without a doubt the Y block expert (75 years old and knows his stuff), we have all concluded it is defiantly the bad choice of paint. With the wrong color, and with even a small amount of UV light, there's a chemical reaction that sucks all the nickel and steel out of the castings. This even goes though the mains and into the crank. It's the steel and nickel content that gives a casting it's strength. What's left is basically carbon which is very brittle.

EDIT:


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-27-2011 at 2:54pm
Originally posted by boat dr boat dr wrote:

Pete, the main cap was removed to show the extent of the damage .
Bruce, the engine is a 312 in my Starflite.


Ugh! What caused that? We ran ours hard yesterday for the first time and I had my fingers crossed the whole time hoping it was going to stay together. That sucks.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-27-2011 at 2:45pm
Originally posted by boat dr boat dr wrote:

Pete, the main cap was removed to show the extent of the damage.

Got it! I have never heard of a history with "Y"'s breaking cranks. Have you?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote boat dr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-27-2011 at 2:39pm
Pete, the main cap was removed to show the extent of the damage .
Bruce, the engine is a 312 in my Starflite.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-27-2011 at 2:34pm
What are these photos of?


Originally posted by uk 1979 part2 uk 1979 part2 wrote:

Jeff, Fresh info from the Boat Dr, be careful as if the wrong pigment combo is used on a Y Blocks over time will weaken the metallurgy and course major failure but even with this damage was able to chug back 6 miles to the dock, always keep it original like Pete said




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-27-2011 at 2:28pm
I want to know what Billy did with the center main cap. I didn't see if he found it in the pan or not. It's got to be there!!! I can sure see why the crank snapped with it missing!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-27-2011 at 1:59pm
What color caused that? Hope it wasn't Dupli color.

Our Y block project has been on hold for the last 1 1/2 years, but we broke it out yesterday and it was running good. Those engines sound so good whether idling or cruising along. Ours was pushing the Classic 45.1 gps, which is a few mph faster than I expected.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote uk 1979 part2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-27-2011 at 1:47pm
Jeff, Fresh info from the Boat Dr, be careful as if the wrong pigment combo is used on a Y Blocks over time will weaken the metallurgy and course major failure but even with this damage was able to chug back 6 miles to the dock, always keep it original like Pete said




lets have a go 2
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-27-2011 at 1:35pm
I remember now. That's a great project. I'm looking forward to seeing more pictures as it progresses.

Did you use Dupli Color?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Inboard Fanatic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-27-2011 at 10:36am
Originally posted by Riley Riley wrote:



Jeff, what year/model century?


Actually it's a different make, I posted about it in the "off topic" section a few weeks ago, Glastron Saberflite.

Jeff
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Inboard Fanatic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-27-2011 at 10:33am
Originally posted by boat dr boat dr wrote:

Jeff, Pete is correct on this subject. The use of any other shade than OEM will cause problems.
I wonder if the poor fuel mileage could a result of the Alpine Green I used to paint mine.I will post pics later of internal damage also caused by " killer paint".
Jeff beware of the Alpine Green, its only cheap when ya buy it....   


Now that's some funny stuff right there!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 81nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-27-2011 at 10:23am
I don't care what color it is that is a very nice job of detailing. Your should be proud.

Pete, I painted the Hemi yesterday but I'm going to make you wait for pictures.

You can’t change the wind but you can adjust your sails
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-27-2011 at 9:59am
Our mustang came with an order sheet from interceptor that had different stuff you could order including a spray can of touch up paint. Somewhere there's a can sitting in someones garage...

Jeff, what year/model century?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote uk1979 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-27-2011 at 7:50am
Real nice Job Jeff
Lets have a go
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote boat dr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-27-2011 at 2:49am
Jeff, Pete is correct on this subject. The use of any other shade than OEM will cause problems.
I wonder if the poor fuel mileage could a result of the Alpine Green I used to paint mine.I will post pics later of internal damage also caused by " killer paint".
Jeff beware of the Alpine Green, its only cheap when ya buy it....   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Inboard Fanatic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-27-2011 at 1:08am
Thanks Riley, I think the debate over original color will rage on forever. I researched this site and others on correct color and found a multitude of answers, so I admit it, I took the easy way out. Now all I need is my hull back so I can put it back in. I'm afraid I may have made a mistake with the shop that has it, he has yet to start any body work. But yet I cannot imagine why, it was 111 degrees here today and his shop is not air-conditioned. Thanks again.

Jeff
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-27-2011 at 12:36am
Jeff that thing looks fantastic. Great job right down the hose clamps. Iit looks every bit as good as the Hilpshes.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-26-2011 at 10:53pm
Originally posted by wingwrench wingwrench wrote:

Looks great Jeff.

Pete,
Alpine Green was a perfect match to the original color on my engine. I found 3 layers of greens when I bead blasted the engine, all different. I matched the first layer. If it isn't correct what is the correct color number?

Jack

Jack,
Then a PO has been in there before you!!!

Originally posted by Inboard Fanatic Inboard Fanatic wrote:

Thanks for the comments. I agree Pete, the Alpine green did not match the original color that I bead blasted off. There does seem to be several variations of the original color out there on engines that supposedly have never been touched. On mine it was lighter with more blue in it, almost like sky blue with a hint of green.

Jeff


Jack.
You are not keeping it as original as I'd like you to be! You need to do more RESEARCH!!      Did you even use the search feature on the site to see what the color should be?????? No one to date has come up with a "color number". In today's state of technology, it's not even needed!!! It's called "color scanning!!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Inboard Fanatic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-26-2011 at 10:34pm
Thanks for the comments. I agree Pete, the Alpine green did not match the original color that I bead blasted off. There does seem to be several variations of the original color out there on engines that supposedly have never been touched. On mine it was lighter with more blue in it, almost like sky blue with a hint of green. Anyway, mine has obviously been redone and the color works for me as far as an "off the shelf" paint goes. The decals did come from Steve Hilpisch, he also confirmed the air horn question for me.

Jeff
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wingwrench Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-26-2011 at 9:49pm
Looks great Jeff.

Pete,
Alpine Green was a perfect match to the original color on my engine. I found 3 layers of greens when I bead blasted the engine, all different. I matched the first layer. If it isn't correct what is the correct color number?

Jack
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-26-2011 at 9:15pm
Looks great Jeff nice job
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-26-2011 at 8:33pm
J.
It looks great but I'm disappointed on the color. Reid got it the closest even though it could be a little darker - however, colors don't always come through correctly on the net.







Did you get the decals from the Steve(s) Hilpisch's?

Bruce and Steve,
Alpine green is NOT correct!!



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Inboard Fanatic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-26-2011 at 8:08pm
Yes, it is Alpine Green. Here are a few more pics, I went ahead and fabricated a bracket to hold the alternator like it is supposed to be. Maybe by next weekend I can get it off the lift and mount the bellhousing with the starter so I can get it running, getting anxious to hear it run.









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