Debt

Thank quantitiative easing for that.

I think the only way we are ever going to see REAL change is to continue to vote in Tea Party types, and take the Senate, and White House. We made big gains in last Novembers elections, but, you can't do it in just one election.

Its also very interesting and encouraging how the national discussion and focus has been on our debt and deficeit spending. Encouraging signs the country is waking up to this mess.



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Good article indeed.

JoeinNY wrote: Pretty much the truth about the current state of the two party system A good read.. if you dismiss this out of hand you might want to think about why

I dismiss it because truth-out.org is a Soros funded 501c3, not what I would consider unbiased.

one will read and still not believe, good read Joe

OverMyHead wrote: phospher wrote:    Your Gore comment... Please, stop spreading lies like all the other partisans. Gore never said he invented the internet. http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Did_Al_Gore_really_say_he_invented_the_internet Al Gore, "When I took the initiative to create the internet" Yea I lied.

How do you feel when you twist the facts and even lie to yourself? I mean really..And again I have to ask, did you even read the article that explains how it happened? And yep snopes get it right too.

phospher wrote:    Your Gore comment... Please, stop spreading lies like all the other partisans. Gore never said he invented the internet. http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Did_Al_Gore_really_say_he_invented_the_internet

Al Gore, "When I took the initiative to create the internet"

Yea I lied.

OverMyHead wrote: And when so many in the private sector are hurting why should public sector jobs be untouchable? the mone for the public sector comes from the private sector and the private sector could create 2 jobs for the price of every postal employee.

But the private sector isn't creating the jobs.   
First the conservatives on this thread said it was because the private sector was being "taxed to death", but still showing record profits.
Then the conservatives shifted to "regulated to death"

Under Clinton we did well.
Bush sucked.
Under Obama, life seems to suck more for the conservatives, yet the corporations they support are recording record profits, despite being taxed, and regulated.

What gives? You should be happy, the corps are rich with profits, and there is talk from the right about cut, cut, cut, from the middle, and not near the top.   You should be very happy.

Most progressives are not happy with Obama, because they do see it this way.   Righties aren't happy with Obama, because????????

OverMyHead wrote: I dont quite see how someone living in china will get the mail to my front door, but whatever. Acxtually we dont need the guys from china since Al Gore invented the internet we can get mail for free, or at least free until the unions loby the government to tax emails 40 cents a piece so the post office can compete.

I was talking in general terms not specifically the USPS. But yes, the internet was the demise of the postal service.

OverMyHead wrote: And when so many in the private sector are hurting why should public sector jobs be untouchable? the mone for the public sector comes from the private sector and the private sector could create 2 jobs for the price of every postal employee.

Actually they would probably create 12 because they would outsource their work to China. But who the heck cares about the American worker anyway? Screw them, I only care about me. Me! Me! Me! Oh and of course my corporate profits.

thats how I started the conversation Dave, Congress shut down the USPS campaign on the "4.95 to ship anywhere in the US" we really are not broke from overspending, we are broke from the lack of jobs in this country,
one must understand that the USPS at the end of the day throws a trillion dollars into the economy, gas, repairs, corner diners, hookers, drug dealers, delivery vehicles, office products, stamp makers. shutting them down not only affects the workers but all the entities that fed off of that trillion dollars.
same identical thing happened here in Cleveland when the mills were shut down, you minus well call Cleveland Chernobyl,
the country is turning into a service country because we no longer have a product to sell, and yes you probably can get top dollar for a service,
in a thriving economy, people must work, you have to keep the cycle going to thrive

Devalueing to some is right pricing to others, market pricing is an increadably reliable form of price regulation. Construction is down. But my company has found a nich in high end high customer service work. we can charge more than most because of what we have proven we can deliver. Those that cannot are working at rates 50 % or more below us. Many have left the industry because they can not find work. All natural regulating forces. The post office is in decline and either needs to find something else they can do better than anyone else and charge accorrdingly, or they need to price and size labor accordingly. You say the labor is not gualified for much else, that means they have no where elso to go and will stay if their wages are cut. If this is the case then they are getting paid to much. Why should tax payers overpay for something they are hardly using? That is why we are broke.

eric lavine wrote: lets throw another 120,000 unskilled into the labor force,

Are you saying we have been paying union scale (Over 50 hr when benifits are included ) for unskilled labor? And you claim they did not overspend?

Speaking of the USPS....I was getting my morning brainwashing, er, uhm, I mean news, from Fox News, and they had a segment on them. The USPS is in really bad shape right now.

- They are going to default on a $5 Billion dollar payment (I assume previous bailout loan) to the Feds....wait for it....unless Congress "takes action" which I'll bet is a euphamism for another bailout (a bailout of the bailout) Whats next....a bailout of the bailout of the bailout?

- They are considering closing 3700 offices, and the possibilty of laying off 120,000 people despite an agreement with our old friend the union that mandates a "no layoff policy".

- Very high labor costs vs. Fed Ex and UPS. Exerpt from an article I found online....

"Years of the agency making contractual promises to unionized workers have caused the service’s labor cost to soar to 80 percent of total expenses. In comparison, similar private shipment businesses have lower labor costs at 53 percent for United Parcel Service and 32 percent for FedEx."

- The USPS is running at a $9 Billion annual deficeit currently.

- If they were a private entity, they would in essence be close to having to file for Chapter 11.   

Hey, I have a GREAT idea.....Lets have the government run our healthcare system. Great idea!!! Why, I'll bet quality would go way up, and costs would come way down in no time at all. But, the biggest benefit of all would be that the government would have even more power over its minions.

Hail to Dear Leader Obama

Eric, I suppose we should be subsidising the candle and buggy whip industries also. The're jobs, so what if technology has rendered them useless. We need a strong economy that creates jobs, not created jobs dragging down our economy.

As for the 4.95 thing, in that case they are the victim of government regulation. That is bad for everyone, and the point I have been trying to make. Regulation is legislators sticking their grubby little fingers into others business trying to get the outcome that benndfits the legislator the most. It always has unintended (or very intended) consequences. That is one of the problems of too much government. It is great that you picked up on that, now just figure out the solution. (Hint, it is not more democrats in office)