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ProTec Ignition Swap

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    Posted: January-07-2025 at 9:17am
Originally posted by rosconole rosconole wrote:

40 degrees of timing ??? are you trying to sell an engine as well?? A GT 40 perhaps . 

Umm, Roscoe, maybe you need to clean your glasses or go brush up on  your math skills or something.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rosconole Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January-07-2025 at 8:53am
40 degrees of timing ??? are you trying to sell an engine as well?? A GT 40 perhaps . 
1989 ski nautique ,1991 barefoot nautique, 1993 Mustang Cobra 1998 5.0 Magazine shootout invitee
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January-07-2025 at 8:48am
I'd check the total advance at about 3500 RPM before doing anything, so you know what you have.

DUI likes to say that there's 24 degrees of advance at 3000 RPM the way it's shipped to you.

Add that 24 to 10 degrees of initial and you get 34.

It seems like numerous people around here get anywhere from 20 to 24 degrees added to their initial when they check, with a lot in the 22ish area.

34 plus or minus 2 would be a good total number to have depending on what octane gas you're using.

So setting it for whatever initial gives 34 total would be a good start.

You might be there now or have to advance it a little

600 ish RPM in gear sounds good for idle RPM

Not knowing what connections you want to cover in black goop, I guess I don't really see the need

I'd wait till the carburetor comes back before doing the timing and idle adjustments unless you just want to practice doing it Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 1993R Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January-06-2025 at 2:34pm
Update
Sorry for the long delay
My boat is up and running strong and starts like it’s brand new again
I did some extra work to get there
I did replace the starter solenoid and both push button fuses
I rewired everything in 10 ga including the tack wire and the power wire to the HEI
Removed all non essential wires from harnes
Refinished the old protect mount in black crinkle finish and loomed all the wires 
Install looks clean and factory
Boat fired right up 
Only two questions
1) the electrical connections had a black silicon applied at factory to help water proof
Anybody know if it’s a specific brand and type. I would like to reapply .
2) The timing is currently set at 10 BTC and 800 rpm. I want to adjust it .
From what I’m reading it should be 12 BTC at 600 rpm at idle correct ?
I plan on retiming the boat but will be sending the carb out for a complete refresh and want everything to be spot on
Thanks

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-03-2024 at 7:22pm
Hope you get going in time for the long weekend Wink

The Red wire in the picture is the only one that needs to be hooked up. 

The connection next to it is for the tach and if it's grounded, the coil won't spark.

It's normally hooked to nothing at all or to the tach wire that runs up to the dash.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 1993R Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-03-2024 at 1:44pm
Keno
I will be jumping in it tonight 
Got tied up at work but have next 5 days off
You may have solved it via the tach wire
I don’t have it going directly to the HEI
Will route it properly and hopefully she fires up
It’s been pretty hot in FL so early morning late nights are only times to work on stuff and feel comfortable 
Would like to get back to skiing again 
Will keep you posted 
Thanks











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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-03-2024 at 11:23am
Originally posted by 1993R 1993R wrote:

I
Only issue is motor and starter are turning but no fire to plug wires

You got this thing making noises like a running engine yet?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rosconole Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-30-2024 at 4:01pm
Just hold the wires together put your foot in a bucket of water and crank it. Let me know if you feel anything.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-30-2024 at 1:36pm
Where are you checking power to the distributor? At the (+) terminal on the cap

Is the tach terminal hooked to the boat's gray tach wire? Nothing else hooked to the tach terminal

Silly question, but is the 3 wire plug from the distributor plugged into the cap firmly?

All 4 connections on the ignition module under the cap connected?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 1993R Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-29-2024 at 7:36pm
I just did this conversion on my 92 ski
Same boat as JPAss 
Everything installed easy and my distributor is positioned just like the photos
TDC has been checked twice. Wires installed properly.
Only issue is motor and starter are turning but no fire to plug wires
Checked power to the HEI and it’s moves between 11 and 12 volts when cranking
Checked my grounds seem okay
Haven’t run new the power and ground wires to dash yet
DEI said it sounded like the unit needed to be grounded and offered a suggestion on how to test it
It didn’t change anything
Any suggestions ?



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-09-2024 at 6:08pm
Originally posted by wkebrdr wkebrdr wrote:

I searched around, but what spark plugs are you using since going to the DUI?

Since this is your first post, nobody knows whether your engine has the standard heads or gt40 heads.

So..........the bestest, most correctest answer is to use the same plugs that are in it now because there were different plugs depending on the heads used Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Jonny Quest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-09-2024 at 1:18pm
Autolite 764 or 104 plugs.  0.055 gap with the DUI.  

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote malcolm2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-09-2024 at 12:23pm
I will have to check.  I don't remember off-hand.  I will get back here and reply with that.

It has been quite a while, and I will say that this change was fan-dam-tastic.  No more hiccups, super quick starts.  ZERO ISSUES.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wkebrdr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-09-2024 at 11:56am
I searched around, but what spark plugs are you using since going to the DUI?
Bill
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-01-2019 at 2:37pm
Originally posted by desertskier desertskier wrote:

I did give that some thought. What I considered is that during 1600 hours of operation my boat has never overheated or gone into limp mode (except when the old wiring had too much IR drop - long time ago). Although the scenarios you mention and others are possible I believe the risk is extremely low. It would be nice to have the limp mode feature still but without it I would rather save the motor.

My boat doesn't have the dash alarm/lights but for those that do it would be easy to replace relay #2 with a timer relay. You could set it to a few minutes so your alarm went off before it killed the engine.

I was also curious what the DUI does when the input voltage drops but I didn't experiment with that yet. It may start running crappy at some point which would give the driver a heads up. So all you would need is a voltage divider on the output of relay #2 that connects to the DUI wire.

According to skidim the switch closes at 210. For some reason I thought I had read somewhere it was higher than that. If it turns out to be a problem it's easy to disconnect unless of course I had a heart attack and crashed then it would be harder.


Good to know you gave it some thought

I've seen the switch listed in PCM literature as both 210 degrees and 200 degrees depending on where you look. It's the same part number for a ProTec engine and a GT40 engine.

If I wanted some kind of protection/warning from the oil pressure and/or water temperature switches, I'd probably wire both to relays that fed a loud, obnoxious horn to let the driver know there's a problem and he/she could turn the engine off or keep running it depending on the situation.

That way O-76 or whoever's driving wouldn't have to find the right relay and yank it and Pete wouldn't have to pull out his wire cutters and snip the right wire in the middle of a "not so good" situation.

I suppose in the end, it's whatever you're comfortable with
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertskier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-01-2019 at 12:57pm
Originally posted by Jonny Quest Jonny Quest wrote:

Nice, clean installation. I like the dedicated relay for the DUI dizzy.

Installing just the first relay would be really easy since you have already done everything else. Just connect 87 to the dizzy without the second relay. I know how much you like projects! But if you want to protect that new roller motor I would install #2 also.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertskier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-01-2019 at 12:44pm
I did give that some thought. What I considered is that during 1600 hours of operation my boat has never overheated or gone into limp mode (except when the old wiring had too much IR drop - long time ago). Although the scenarios you mention and others are possible I believe the risk is extremely low. It would be nice to have the limp mode feature still but without it I would rather save the motor.

My boat doesn't have the dash alarm/lights but for those that do it would be easy to replace relay #2 with a timer relay. You could set it to a few minutes so your alarm went off before it killed the engine.

I was also curious what the DUI does when the input voltage drops but I didn't experiment with that yet. It may start running crappy at some point which would give the driver a heads up. So all you would need is a voltage divider on the output of relay #2 that connects to the DUI wire.

According to skidim the switch closes at 210. For some reason I thought I had read somewhere it was higher than that. If it turns out to be a problem it's easy to disconnect unless of course I had a heart attack and crashed then it would be harder.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-01-2019 at 12:28pm
Originally posted by Orlando76 Orlando76 wrote:

Well Ken, while you’re clutching your chest dying just pop open the dog box and jump the relay! Did I miss where it shuts off at 200? That’s a lil low, I’d step it up to at least 230.

or cut ether wires at terminal 86.

At what temperature does the temp switch close? 200?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Orlando76 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-01-2019 at 11:55am
Well Ken, while you’re clutching your chest dying just pop open the dog box and jump the relay! Did I miss where it shuts off at 200? That’s a lil low, I’d step it up to at least 230.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-01-2019 at 8:36am
Originally posted by desertskier desertskier wrote:




Relay #2 is normally closed and will open when the existing protec water temp switch detects an over temp condition. This will kill the engine if it starts to overheat.

I was originally going to use the oil pressure switch as well but when starting the engine it takes a few cranks to get enough pressure to open the switch so the engine didn't start right away. I just disconnected the wire at the oil pressure switch and capped it off.

I mounted a third relay as a spare. It's not connected to anything.


This may seem rather silly of me, but why would you want to automatically turn off the engine at 200 degrees?

It sounds like a good idea to protect the engine, but I'd say it's a "not so good idea" for the safety of you and anybody else in your boat.

It takes away the ability of the driver to survey the situation and decide whether to keep running the engine till it self destructs if necessary.

Take a situation where you're in the boat with serious medical issues like a heart attack for example.

The driver is headed for the dock/launch ramp where medical assistance is waiting but your engine temp hits 200 degrees and it shuts down about 1/4 mile from life saving help.

I guess you could say, "well I'm gonna die out here but don't worry, we saved the engine" or on the other hand " we cooked the engine but at least I'm still alive"   

It was built with the limp feature instead of automatically turning off the engine on low oil pressure or high water temp for a reason.






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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jonny Quest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-01-2019 at 1:51am
Nice, clean installation. I like the dedicated relay for the DUI dizzy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertskier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-01-2019 at 12:58am
I recently replaced my Protec with a DUI. I used the same parts and did the installation basically the same as JPASS but decided to install a couple of relays as well. Here is the schematic and a link to the relays that I used





Link to Summit Racing Relays P/N 5593PT

The relays connect battery voltage directly from the 50amp breaker to the DUI rather than the existing method of routing the voltage through the dash and key switch.

Relay #1 is normally open and will close when the key is turned to the on or start position applying voltage to the DUI.

Relay #2 is normally closed and will open when the existing protec water temp switch detects an over temp condition. This will kill the engine if it starts to overheat.

I was originally going to use the oil pressure switch as well but when starting the engine it takes a few cranks to get enough pressure to open the switch so the engine didn't start right away. I just disconnected the wire at the oil pressure switch and capped it off.

I mounted a third relay as a spare. It's not connected to anything.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dreaming Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-01-2016 at 2:16pm
Thank you JPASS - My DUI is installed and the boat runs!   I have a 94 that came with the Protec Injection as well,   This set of installation instructions works for TBI boats as well, as long as you are replacing the TBI with a carb.    The TBI wiring harness is essentially separate with the exception of the interconnected tach wire and one other yellow wire.   there are some extra sensors to input to the TBI module that will be abandoned in place.   The wiring can all come out though.    You will need to remove the 15A circuit breaker on the back of the engine ( leave the 60 and the 12.5) and you can reinstall the 2 remaining breakers on the bracket that the was originally mounted too.   the FI module bracket is no longer needed and should be removed for accessibility. While you are working through the wiring harness, the original (Non TBI) wiring harness already includes wiring for the electric choke on the Holley Carb, all you need to do is un-tape the wires from the harness (they're covered up) and plug them in.

Lesson learned:   Nicely routed plug wires are great, but err on the side of making the wires too long...   they looked fantastic until I timed the engine, and I wound up with a couple of wires that were tight...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dreaming Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-16-2016 at 6:43pm
Perfect!   Thank you !
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hollywood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-16-2016 at 6:39pm
90s on both ends
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dreaming Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-16-2016 at 6:15pm
JPass - or one of the other guys that has done this swap,   I am looking to get my order placed with summit, and would like to know which wire set you ended up with?    
the Taylor Spiro pro has lots of choices, so I want to make sure I get the correct item.
I have gt-40 heads in my 94

- 90° boots or some other angle?

are these correct?     
Taylor Wires - Summit

EDIT: LINK CHANGED TO 90° END KIT FOR FUTURE REFERENCE
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote michiel200 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-07-2016 at 7:30am
Last weekend, I set the timing with a lamp and made a test drive.
The result is amazing. It starts on the button and accelerates better than ever. Especially above 4000 rpm. It feels it gains an extra 40 hp at high rpm. I should have done this much earlier. JP, again many thanks for your instructions. This made the swap real easy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote michiel200 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-29-2016 at 8:32am
This morning, I put the distributor more 'early' than I did before.
And she started rightaway and ran smooth. For about a minute.
The engine choked, obviously because of a lack of fuel.

I started investing the fuel filter housing. Because this winter, I renewed the filter. But it didn't came with a new rubber ring. So I went to a local tractor shop, and they had a ring that fitted oke. Now it occurs that the ring was not oke, but too big (it expanded). It caused what we call over here 'false air', the housing was not closed tight so the pump was not able to get fuel into the carb. The engine ran on the fuel that was in the carb when I put the fuel hose straight on the pump, skipping the filter.

So this week I get a new ring and have the timing set. And hopefully I can enjoy the new ignition. And a lesson learned not to work on fuel and ignition at the same time. This makes troubleshooting a lot more complex.
Many thanks for your suggestions!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-28-2016 at 12:13pm
Verify timing order. The rotor rotates counter clockwise.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote malcolm2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-28-2016 at 11:55am
I did this swap and have a post called "Voltage for my pro-tec swap", search that. Or click on my name and look for my posts to find it..... Unless you have already looked at it. There are a few more details on DUI set up on my post.

I was thinking about the timing light to check that you have juice from the DUI to each plug. If you clamp the inductive connector to the wires 1 at a time and power up the light, then turn the boat key and hold at start while you pull the timing light trigger, the light will flash (if you are getting juice), regardless of what cylinder wire it is on. Just point the timing light to the carpet. A quicker and less-shocking way to check that the DUI is working. You still don't know you get spark, but you eliminate the DUI as the prob.

That is how I found out my coil packs were not working.

Make sure the DUI cap is on tightly and properly. the hold down hooks are wonky. I can't remember what the DUI has for a rotor, but check inside once more.

Careful on unfiltered fuel. Good way to block up your carb.
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