ZDDP Question

SNobsessed wrote: Guessing that the valve springs on that '51 flat head were not high strength!

The two cams I saw without some of the lobes were out of Hercules/Chris flat heads that in both cases the owner thought he was doing the engine good by going to "modern" oils.

And rpm's compared to today was low. Good old non detergent oil so all that gunk wasn't circulating around the motor but instead settled to the bottom of the pan

No scanner so this is the best I could do with the digital camera.

I ran across this Texaco oil ad in 1951 Motor Boating. Interesting they used a CC 42' flying bridge cruiser!!

Ken,
What do think the ZDDP levers were back then? Note, Texaco hadn't even come out with their Havoline oil yet!!

Duane in Indy wrote: curiouslibra wrote: Oops sorry I missed the link. I was just more concerned with the poster that said he used Lucas ZDDP additive to bring up his ZDDP levels but the test show that it did more harm than good and since I didn’t see anybody tell him to go look at the chart I assumed no one had already posted that here sorry. Think you are confused about what product you are talking about. The study tested a different product than what I had posted. I have no factual information about where the Lucas product rates. BTW I can't recall reading where a CCF person has experienced a camshaft failure due to oil related issues. Pete you are right: it's a cold hard winter

Hi Duane

Here's a thread from 10 years ago with some people who had camshaft failures for various different reasons that they blamed on oil. Was it really the oil's fault? .I figure oil has changed some but not much has changed in the last 10 years as far as discussions go and in the next 10 the same discussions will continue. .

old thread

I guess some people will think the sky is falling and some will figure it's a mighty small percentage that had problems

Oops sorry I missed the link. I was just more concerned with the poster that said he used Lucas ZDDP additive to bring up his ZDDP levels but the test show that it did more harm than good and since I didn’t see anybody tell him to go look at the chart I assumed no one had already posted that here sorry.

curiouslibra wrote: just when I thought this thread was starting to slow down, I found this test that was very eye opening on ZDDP levels and how they are not the only factor in protecting your engine. I also post this link because they also test ZDDP additives and none of them helped! in fact they reduced the protect and sometimes by a big percent! http://www.sccoa.com/forums/showthread.php?136304-What-oil-brands-offer-the-best-protection-***Good-read***

I figure that before you post what you think is some groundbreaking earth shattering news you should read the whole thread here on CCF and you'll find the same link you just posted.

Look at a post by phatsat67 on Nov 8th of last year

ZDDP/zinc/phosphorus levels fall pretty easily into that category of "things that there's no firm answer to"

I guess I need another boat for a litmus test, 2 is not enough!

If you guys are gonna disagree with Roscoe, could you at least get your info straight.

You talk about motor oil with no ZDDP................all MOTOR OIL has ZDDP in it. Some have more than others

The newer passenger car motor oils have 700 to 850 ppm zinc and the generally accepted magic number is around 1100 to 1200 ppm for older flat tappet engines.

I figure, to each his own, if Roscoe wants to run a lower zinc oil he can take his chances, it's his engine

I'm still trying to figure out why the Jeep Cherokee I had that fell apart around the engine was still running just fine with 250,000 plus miles on low ZDDP/zinc oil of around 800 ppm. No camshaft /lifter issues, just good old salt related rust issues.

Here's a link to the PQIA website where you can look at the oils they tested and see zinc and phosphorus levels in both the passenger car oil section and the diesel oil section

PQIA

MrMcD wrote: Ross, Pete is correct. If you don't want to use zddp install a roller camshaft and lifters. Flat tappet cams need zddp for protection against wear. Mark

Ross,
Hopefully you haven't gone to a non ZDDP oil!!

rosconole wrote: ZDDP is actually only specd at break in so its a moot point now really. .

Ross,
Lots including myself have a different opinion. I have seen first hand the damage done when non ZDDP oils were used on well broken in flat tappet engines.

That's not as good.

TRBenj wrote: $9/qt, ouch.

Yeah, but we get 2-3% increase in RPM with it!

I didn't know you can buy Amsoil at Napa? Thought it had to be through a dealer.

I used the Amsoil Diesel & Marine 15-40 in a Suburban diesel that I did a test on with the help of an Amsoil dealer, we did uoa on every change. It's an outstanding oil.

rosconole wrote: 15w40 marine & diesel amsoil since I can use the same in powerstroke and buy in 5 gallons at a time @ 133 for my dealer price.

Great price. I pay $90~ for 2.5 gals at NAPA.

Duane in Indy wrote: Must be a cold hard winter to have beat this thread so long, and to have done it last year also.

Duane,
I'm sure it will continue with more winters in the future!