A 351w (stroker?) from scratch... |
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JoeinNY
Grand Poobah Joined: October-19-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5698 |
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Whatever it is that likes to knock again off again was on again after a day of hard running in Lake George with Reid, Critter, and Flyn Brian. We popped the breaker giving the little orange mustang a jump, and after idleing around around for about an hour being slightly aggressive with the volume on the sound system, the boat died and when we reset the breaker and jumped it back up it came back with a serious alternator squeak/stick and a less serious but there knock. The alt noise eventually went away after the battery charged it went back on the trailer with a little knock.
So out it comes, best case scenario actually as it made it though the season and then died. I would hate to have put it away for the year thinking it was fine then have problems in the spring. I have of course really wanted to pull it since the first failure which was the dist gear as I have had night mares of where those gear pieces ended up, then once I got into valves sticking the writing was on the wall but with it running good and quiet it was hard to justify. Now I have justification and you know while it's out... |
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RainDog
Platinum Member Joined: February-21-2007 Location: Mke/Grn Lake WI Status: Offline Points: 1387 |
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Oh come on! What the hell else could you do except run it on the nitrous that is already there? |
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JoeinNY
Grand Poobah Joined: October-19-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5698 |
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I think I am going to leave it at I am going to put a fresh set of plugs in it, and see how she runs. |
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lewy2001
Grand Poobah Joined: March-19-2008 Location: NSW Australia Status: Offline Points: 2234 |
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Joe did you convert it to marine or was it already a marine carby. I am looking at a mechanical sec 600cfm with center adjustable floats & viewable bowls. My Holley 600cfm needs new needles and a front float and I was looking at this carby as a option. I find the standard marine carby with side hung internally adjustable floats a pain to get right. Also all the Holley kits in Aus only seem to be for the externally adjustable float bowls which have different needle & seats. I could order a kit from Skidim and a float but was thinking if I could put my J tubes in this carby as it runs a Holley body. Is there in other difference in a marine carby other than the j tubes? I think I would move my electric choke mechanism over as well if it fits. |
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If you're going through hell, keep going
89 Ski <a href="http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5685" ta |
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JoeinNY
Grand Poobah Joined: October-19-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5698 |
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Lewy,
Mine is a Marine carb and came that way from the factory, its very nice its not cheap but I would buy another. In fact I am buying another slightly larger one for this boat, and moving this one to my mustang. I doubt there is any performance difference if both are well tuned but the demons are quality units and look pretty good for a calibrated gas leak. If you do convert an auto version, expect it to look like crap pretty quick unless you keep it oiled up. |
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nuttyskier2002
Gold Member Joined: September-28-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 669 |
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Joe, if you haven't bought your new carb yet I have a bran new Holley 4150 mechanical secondary marine carb still in the box for sale. I bought it to put on my Malibu along with the new Vortec heads but decided to use the original Weber instead. I'll make you a good deal if interested. - Brian
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95 Malibu Echelon w/Mercruiser 350 Magnum Skier
Former boats: 88 Ski Centurion Tru Trac II 59 Chris Craft Capri (woody) |
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GottaSki
Grand Poobah Joined: April-21-2005 Location: NE CT Status: Offline Points: 3357 |
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Yes there are.
It takes more than J-tubes to make a marine carb. Among others, The throttle shafts are -ringed so fuel doesn't leak out them if, er, when the float needle sticks open and floods the carb. Also external float adjustment and sight plugs are a modern no-no. |
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"There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing."
River Rat to Mole |
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JoeinNY
Grand Poobah Joined: October-19-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5698 |
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Thanks for the offer Brian but I already have a perfectly good new 750 cfm holley marine carb prepped for the boat with the choke horn cut off and smoothed and the metering plate changed out, basically I am just getting another bg for the pretty factor. The don't have sight plugs but they have sight glasses and externally adjusted floats..
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boat dr
Grand Poobah Joined: June-27-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 4245 |
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Brian, what is the price shipped to the boat doctors shop. That is not what the Doc ordered but if the price is correct we may be able to deal..........Billy
Or better yet give me a call 1-318-386-2825 |
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nuttyskier2002
Gold Member Joined: September-28-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 669 |
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Doc you can have it shipped for $250.00 total. Will that work for ya?
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95 Malibu Echelon w/Mercruiser 350 Magnum Skier
Former boats: 88 Ski Centurion Tru Trac II 59 Chris Craft Capri (woody) |
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boat dr
Grand Poobah Joined: June-27-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 4245 |
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Brian, Give me a call and we will work out the details, adress etc......Billy
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lewy2001
Grand Poobah Joined: March-19-2008 Location: NSW Australia Status: Offline Points: 2234 |
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Thanks for the info GottaSki I will pass on the carby then but why are the external floats & sight plugs a modern no-no. Being able to get float height easily set was one of the features I really liked about Holley carbs. |
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If you're going through hell, keep going
89 Ski <a href="http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5685" ta |
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79nautique
Grand Poobah Joined: January-27-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 7872 |
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I would say because the fuel can actually wick through the threads over time on that style carb. |
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nuttyskier2002
Gold Member Joined: September-28-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 669 |
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Doc, We were so busy discussing other things that I forgot to get your shipping address when we talked this afternoon. Send me a post with your address and I'll get it shipped Saturday. - Brian |
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95 Malibu Echelon w/Mercruiser 350 Magnum Skier
Former boats: 88 Ski Centurion Tru Trac II 59 Chris Craft Capri (woody) |
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JoeinNY
Grand Poobah Joined: October-19-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5698 |
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So I am now finally into it...
found the culprit.. I went to the plumbing store to get components when maybe i should have went to the automotive store. this cruddy fitting didnt take the weight of the two sending units and after pounding on the waves of lake george she broke and started leaking.. So a little cruddy adapter fails and the fall out is... Looks alright here ... but whats this... a disgusting about of debris.. might be this .. that black rod stick out like a sore thumb.. off to the machine shop we go... |
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81nautique
Grand Poobah Joined: September-03-2005 Location: Big Rock, Il Status: Offline Points: 5778 |
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Joe, did you actually run the oil out of it or was it just a leak? Sure hope the cranks not toast. You think you possibly got some debris into a journal and restricted the oil to that rod?
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You can’t change the wind but you can adjust your sails
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JoeinNY
Grand Poobah Joined: October-19-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5698 |
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It was out of oil, i am guessing the crank can be saved, will know for sure tomorrow when I pull it out..
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eric lavine
Grand Poobah Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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i dont want to be the reaper, but that crank is purple, sorry to see that one
telltales might not be a bad option. you cant always watch the gauges |
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"the things you own will start to own you"
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boat dr
Grand Poobah Joined: June-27-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 4245 |
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Joe, that little rig job cost you big time.
As fanatical as you have been to dot every I and cross every T and you use brass for oil senders, 1/4 to 1/8 to support that much weight?????? We wont do that again will we!!!!!!!!!! |
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JoeinNY
Grand Poobah Joined: October-19-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5698 |
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that's why we post, I blow them up so you don't have to...
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uk1979
Platinum Member Joined: June-13-2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1422 |
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Joe sorry to see the pictures/news but hats off to you some would have not post the bad news, you will soon have it running again.
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Lets have a go
56 Starflite 77 SN 78 SN 80 BFN |
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81nautique
Grand Poobah Joined: September-03-2005 Location: Big Rock, Il Status: Offline Points: 5778 |
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You have a great attitude dude... it's only money right and look at all the fun you're having. I have a very similar setup on the 81 so I'll have to take a look at that this spring. I can't count the number of times I almost unhooked the low oil pressure buzzer because it's so irritating when starting the boat, It will now stay connected!!!! |
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You can’t change the wind but you can adjust your sails
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Riley
Grand Poobah Joined: January-19-2004 Location: Portland, ME Status: Offline Points: 7953 |
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That's awful, and you had that engine running so well. Is that smaller sensor for the fuel pump or an alarm? Why didn't the alarm go off or fuel pump shut down?
Boat Dr, most of those rigs I've seen are made of brass. What else can you use? |
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JoeinNY
Grand Poobah Joined: October-19-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5698 |
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Its not the brass thats the problem its the cruddy thinwalled plumbing type piece I used, should have gotten a nice hydraulic grade weatherhead fitting, but it was a sunday, yadda yadda.. boom.
The smaller sensor runs the fuel pump, but its a pretty low pressure cutout and there is plenty of fuel still in the bowls to cause trouble, I usually keep a pretty good eye on the guages but I dont always drive so the alarm couldnt hurt. I got back to the shop tonight for a couple hours to finish the tear down, somehow the pictures didnt save but the crank looks pretty good, roughed up a little but it only measures two thou under the rest so it should be salvageable with a grind and an oversized bearing, the connecting rod doesnt look too bad either. ... more once the block and crank come back from the machine shop but could be a while... |
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MaddMarxx
Platinum Member Joined: June-29-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1741 |
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Joe..wow, it looks like you went panning for gold!
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Hollywood
Moderator Group Joined: February-04-2004 Location: Twin Lakes, WI Status: Offline Points: 13513 |
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I'm still not following what the 2 problems have to do with each other. How would the guage pick up one rod bearing running out of oil?
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79nautique
Grand Poobah Joined: January-27-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 7872 |
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chips got lodge in the passage way for the one journal starving it of oil, could have been any one, some might not have been as severlly blocked as the one that's why I would assume it's coming completely apart to clean all of the chips/junk out of the block. |
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JoeinNY
Grand Poobah Joined: October-19-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5698 |
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It wasnt just one rod bearing that ran out of oil, the whole engine ran out of oil after it leaked through that fitting, that rod just happened to seize up first. Once the initial seize happens its just an idle back to the dock and an idle from the dock to the trailer away from turning a now scored bearing into many little pieces of bearing.
Btw, word from the machine shop is that the crank should clean up with a .010 under grinding and the block looks good... |
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79nautique
Grand Poobah Joined: January-27-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 7872 |
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I'm just wondering how many more lives this block has left in it before something punches thru it and turns it to junk.
the hyd. grade helps but I don't think you want to step it down a size like you did last time As that was the point Billy was trying to stress. It just looks like too much junk in the pan to be all bearing's seems odd too for them to chunk like that, appears like oil passage ways where not cleaned out completetly or that's the dist gear but thought you cleaned it out after that, There's just an awfull lot of crap in the bottom of the pan and it's hard to beleive all was from the bearings. |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Joe,
I'm always sorry to hear about problems like this but I do know that the repair is in good hands with yourself. You'll get it! BTW, too bad it's not a BBC. I know someone who's had one torn down and put back together so many times lately that he's become a expert. If it was a BBC, he could have given you some help!! |
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