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mdvalant View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mdvalant Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Engine Temp
    Posted: May-18-2010 at 1:40pm
Hey gang, me again...

Another question about my buddy's '91 196. Used it all weekend for pulling the ski team around and it ran perfectly. One thing we have noticed is that it runs at a rather high temperature which is right around 175-180. Running in it the driveway with the fake-a-lake it pumps water through the motor very well, as it flows out the exhaust very nicely. (kind of ruling out the impeller, and if I'm not mistaken the impeller was replaced less than 100 hrs ago.) What are things we need to look at? Is this even a problem? Thermostat? Thanks!!

-Mike
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'00 Sport
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GottaSki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-18-2010 at 2:08pm
Some impellars run 20 hours, some 200.

First check the tranny heat exchanger for debris.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hollywood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-18-2010 at 2:34pm
His tranny heat exchanger is behind the impeller. What t-stat is in there?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mdvalant Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-18-2010 at 2:35pm
Hell if I know, HW. This is why I'm here! haha I can check it out sometime though...

On that note...my dad's 90 runs around 140, has all its life. Is that cold?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hollywood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-18-2010 at 2:38pm
Get the facks first. Clean the connections on the sender and gauge. I changed our first impeller after 500 hrs when the temp would hang at 180, with a 143 thermostat.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mdvalant Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-18-2010 at 2:45pm
Ok, I will look into it. Thank you sir!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kapla Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-18-2010 at 8:15pm
did he replaced the t-stat lately? a 160º stat will run in that t...
I had the same issues on mine...replaced it with the correct 143 and t dropped drastically to the normal 140-160 band...
also I would check all hoses clamp are tight, use the wrench to adjust them...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 75 Tique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-19-2010 at 11:29am
Originally posted by mdvalant mdvalant wrote:

Running in it the driveway with the fake-a-lake it pumps water through the motor very well, as it flows out the exhaust very nicely. (kind of ruling out the impeller, and if I'm not mistaken the impeller was replaced less than 100 hrs ago.)


If you are running it on the fake-a-lake, the hose pressure could be pushing the water through the engine and the pump could be doing nothing. Put your intake hose into a bucket and see if the pump is really pumping.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote storm34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-19-2010 at 2:02pm
Out of pure curiosity... is there a way to test a t-stat out of the boat? Maybe place it in a pot on the stove?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 75 Tique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-19-2010 at 2:04pm
Originally posted by storm34 storm34 wrote:

Out of pure curiosity... is there a way to test a t-stat out of the boat? Maybe place it in a pot on the stove?



Exactly.

Hard to believe because you would think water pressure would have something to do with it too, but I have seen doing the pot test referred to a number of times on here.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-20-2010 at 2:42am
I'm having the same issue with mine, 240hp RH rotation. As the boat warms up, it gets up to 180-200 range and stays there. The exhause manifolds get warm but not "hot", I can hold my hand there for a while.

This is in the water, I haven't tried running it on a hose. I'm not sure of the best way to do that and didn't want to damage anything.

I already changed the t-stat to a new 143 degree one. It was probably not a bad idea, and cheap insurance for $10, because the old one looked kinda rusty and stuff. It didn't actually change anything though.

So, is electrical connection check the logical next to do, or impeller change? Not sure when that was done last, just got the boat.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote OverMyHead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-20-2010 at 3:21am
The impellor is a great place to start. I would want to know its condition regardless, but especially if running warm. It might be in pieces all through your engine.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-20-2010 at 12:31pm
Originally posted by Bri892001 Bri892001 wrote:

I'm having the same issue with mine, 240hp RH rotation. As the boat warms up, it gets up to 180-200 range and stays there. The exhause manifolds get warm but not "hot", I can hold my hand there for a while.

This is in the water, I haven't tried running it on a hose. I'm not sure of the best way to do that and didn't want to damage anything.

I already changed the t-stat to a new 143 degree one. It was probably not a bad idea, and cheap insurance for $10, because the old one looked kinda rusty and stuff. It didn't actually change anything though.

So, is electrical connection check the logical next to do, or impeller change? Not sure when that was done last, just got the boat.


do you run without a sea strainer or does it have one?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 75 Tique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-20-2010 at 12:44pm
Originally posted by Bri892001 Bri892001 wrote:

I haven't tried running it on a hose. I'm not sure of the best way to do that and didn't want to damage anything.


hose-bucket method
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hollywood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-20-2010 at 12:48pm
You can burn up an impeller in like 10 seconds, doesn't care if it had 0 hours or 500 if you like to run it dry. I'm pretty sure I've seen someone online do it once on purpose, it melted faster than I thought it would.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WakeSlayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-20-2010 at 1:23pm
Your temp guage and sender could be incompatible. I was shipped the wrong sender with a new guage last year, and it read quite high. My laser temp gun read the accurate temp, so I knew I did not have an actual problem with engine temp.
An 89 should have a strainer in it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TX Foilhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-20-2010 at 6:49pm
If you look at the thermostat housing when the tstat is closed cold water goes out the e
exhaust. As it opens the motor begins to mix cold water coming to the engine with warm water coming out and then sends it out the exhaust. Either way the elbow on the exhaust manifolds are getting cooler water than what's in the engine. The only way I see the touch test being any good is to tell you if there is no water getting to the exhaust. Digital thermometer and a bucket are the way to go, and don't use automotive thermostats even if they are rated the same temp,I learned that lesson last year.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote boat dr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-20-2010 at 8:00pm
Originally posted by TX Foilhead TX Foilhead wrote:

don't use automotive thermostats even if they are rated the same temp,I learned that lesson last year.



Sure to be a hit as a new Topic Section.......

What Not To Do......Perfectly good ideas that do not work....

Nahhhhhh, that would be to easy, never mind..........Boat dr
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TX Foilhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-20-2010 at 8:55pm
It did work, but the boat running a steady 190 or so leaves little time for watching anything but the temp guage.   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-21-2010 at 12:19pm
Well, I got my T-Stat from Ski Dim, so it's definitely a marine unit. It actually looked considerably beefier than the one that had been in there. But yeah, I have no idea what kind of shape the impeller is in. Is that a relatively straight forward job, any special tools?

I'll look around for documentation on how that's done, unless someone has it handy?

Oh, and mine does have a strainer. I checked it and cleaned it already, there was minimal debris. Mine had enough clearance to just unscrew the glass/plastic "jar" piece without undoing the hoses and everything.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-21-2010 at 12:49pm
Originally posted by TX Foilhead TX Foilhead wrote:

It did work, but the boat running a steady 190 or so leaves little time for watching anything but the temp guage.   


yea because you bought a 180 T-stat which is speced for a typical car application, you can get them in 190 and 195 too and on and on, but that isn't what is needed for a boat engine, in this case 143 is applicable temp rating, letting the engine run at around 160, now if you have a closed cooling then 160 t-stat is used and it runs around 180 all of the time.

So when apples to aples are compared there isn't a marine grade t-stat just a different temperature rated t-stat so you have to be smarter and buy the correct parts enstead of walking in and saying I need a t-stat.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TX Foilhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-21-2010 at 1:13pm
Impeler is easy, just make sure you mark the flow direction first because some of them can be installed bacerds.

The thermostat was an exact copy of the 160 it was replacing. What was different, and I had to put both in a pan to find this out, was that the auto one opened slowly while the marine on opened all the way at 160. It was the slow opening that was causing the problem in the boat, ina vehilcle that is running 200+ that wouldn't have been an issue. It might even be an an alright thermostat to use in the winter here so the heater works a little better, but too much of a PITA to have to change it all the time.   The boat runs between 160 and 170 in water that is 80 to 85 in the summer and 150 to 160 in 45 to 50 degree water in the winter. We rarely see 3000 rpm's so it stays fairly cool most of the time.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-21-2010 at 1:19pm
Originally posted by TX Foilhead TX Foilhead wrote:

Impeler is easy, just make sure you mark the flow direction first because some of them can be installed bacerds.

The thermostat was an exact copy of the 160 it was replacing. What was different, and I had to put both in a pan to find this out, was that the auto one opened slowly while the marine on opened all the way at 160. It was the slow opening that was causing the problem in the boat, ina vehilcle that is running 200+ that wouldn't have been an issue. It might even be an an alright thermostat to use in the winter here so the heater works a little better, but too much of a PITA to have to change it all the time.   The boat runs between 160 and 170 in water that is 80 to 85 in the summer and 150 to 160 in 45 to 50 degree water in the winter. We rarely see 3000 rpm's so it stays fairly cool most of the time.


the t-stat controls the temp not the engine, it opened slow because it was bad or of a higher rated temp. Or then it just could have been the way it was in the pan and the thermal transfer properties envolved, like how the T-stat was sitting in the pan.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TX Foilhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-21-2010 at 1:37pm
Almost forgot, last night while I was working down at the dock one of the weekend neighbors showed up. He uncovers his low hour 06 Mastercraft which I don't believe has even touched the water this year and fires it up 3 feet above the water. Then he lowers it down to about 6in above the water and starts it again and lowers it into the water running. As he drove by the dock I mentioned he should keep an eye on the temp guage because the impeller won't last long running it out of the water. He kind of ignores me and drives off, comes back about 5 minutes later, parks the boat opens the hatch and starts making phone calls. Wish I was a little closer so I could have heard what he was saying.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote skicat2001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-21-2010 at 1:55pm
Originally posted by TX Foilhead TX Foilhead wrote:

Almost forgot, last night while I was working down at the dock one of the weekend neighbors showed up. He uncovers his low hour 06 Mastercraft which I don't believe has even touched the water this year and fires it up 3 feet above the water. Then he lowers it down to about 6in above the water and starts it again and lowers it into the water running. As he drove by the dock I mentioned he should keep an eye on the temp guage because the impeller won't last long running it out of the water. He kind of ignores me and drives off, comes back about 5 minutes later, parks the boat opens the hatch and starts making phone calls. Wish I was a little closer so I could have heard what he was saying.


Those guys there you feel sorrry for, but guys that start a boat with out any water running through it is just astronomical to the motor and impellar.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TX Foilhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-21-2010 at 1:57pm
I'm not sure what it was, but I had the same issue with 2 different thermostats I got at Napa. First one looked different so the second time I made sure I got one that looked the same. Might just be some of that special Chinese engenieering or something.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-21-2010 at 2:18pm
Originally posted by TX Foilhead TX Foilhead wrote:

I'm not sure what it was, but I had the same issue with 2 different thermostats I got at Napa. First one looked different so the second time I made sure I got one that looked the same. Might just be some of that special Chinese engenieering or something.


no just the guy buying the T-stat that doesn't pay attention to details and doesn't install the correct temperature rated t-stat, 143 degrees is the correct rating not 160 BTW, So with your higher rated t-stat it's going to run hotter and in the range you quote a 160 stat runs at 180 and above.

So when the Proper rated T-stat is used the engine stays at the correct temp and doesn't run hot like yours does if it's running 180 plus.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TX Foilhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-21-2010 at 3:01pm
Not the wrong tstat, it's the one I wanted and the one I bought been using 160 for the last 600 hrs or so. I like the boat a little warmer because we run with a lite load at slower speeds. If we spent the day footing or wakeboarding with some ballast then it might run in the range it does now with a 143. Yes I can run it up in the mid 40's and get the temp up above 180, but really not that big of a deal as long as I know everything is cooling properly it's still running cooler than the truck that brought it to the lake.    

As for the neighbors with more money than sense, I'm glad they are there because without them I couldn't live at the lake full time, they are entertaining.   I'm also glad they are only around on the weekends during the summer. That leaves me a lot of time to have the lake almost to myself and my aparentlly overheated boat.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-21-2010 at 4:12pm
Impeller Replacement:
In the image here:Impeller Pic
From this article:http://www.aquaskier.com/articles/impeller_replacement.htm
It suggests that you should sort of "comb" the blades of the new impeller so they look the same as the ones from the old impeller. Or maybe you just accomplish the same thing by flipping it, depending on how stiff the rubber is.

My question is this, if the impeller is burnt up, or pretty well worn down, will you be able to tell which way the blades are supposed to be "combed"?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 75 Tique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-21-2010 at 4:22pm
With or without the old impeller, you should be able to figure out how to comb it at installtion. If you took your pump off, hold it sort of where it goes in the boat. You have a left hand rotation motor, so envision, with your pump in place, which way it will rotate. Form the blades in the proper direction as you push the impeller in.

Question to anyone else: Does it really matter which way the blades are "combed" upon installation? Won't they just flip to the rcorrect orientation when you turn the pulley, either by hand or when back on the motor? I just replaced mine a few weeks ago and that seemed to be the case.
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