Starflite Rebuild |
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uk1979
Platinum Member Joined: June-13-2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1422 |
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Moved the Starflite up on the first floor and into the old part of the building, I had a few challenges to do it but you can fit the hull through a 3ft 1/2in opening.
Shall leave the hull up on its side to make the templates of the frame and measure up its easy no climbing in and out. |
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Lets have a go
56 Starflite 77 SN 78 SN 80 BFN |
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Morfoot
Grand Poobah Joined: February-06-2004 Location: South Lanier Status: Offline Points: 5320 |
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Thats insane Roger...Larry, Moe, and Curly weren't close by were they?
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"Morfoot; He can ski. He can wakeboard.He can cook chicken.He can create his own self-named beverage, & can also apparently fly. A man of many talents."72 Mustang "Kermit",88 SN Miss Scarlett, 99 SN "Sherman"
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Keeganino
Grand Poobah Joined: October-27-2009 Location: North Carolina Status: Offline Points: 2063 |
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Holy jeepers! Toys for days! Reminds me of my grandfather who led a cow up to the second story of the music building in college. Luckily for the school there was some sort of hoist for getting pianos in and out so they just let it out the window.
I like your idea of measuring while on its side. Makes perfect sense and will save your back. |
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"working on these old boats may not be cost effective but as it shows its what it brings into your life that matters" -Roger
1973 Skier |
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Mark Mel
Gold Member Joined: September-16-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 583 |
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Reminds me of the story of the guy that built a boat in his basement...lol
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uk1979
Platinum Member Joined: June-13-2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1422 |
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I found this under the gas tank when I was cleaning the hull out a Canadian 25c its paying me back already if it was lost around its date 1969 may have been worth a gallon of gas.
The other side has our Queens head so the boat was always heading for the UK. |
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Lets have a go
56 Starflite 77 SN 78 SN 80 BFN |
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Keeganino
Grand Poobah Joined: October-27-2009 Location: North Carolina Status: Offline Points: 2063 |
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That is pretty cool! I found a rare 1943 steel penny when restoring the Skier. There was a bunch of change under the gas tank and and when I was cleaning it up one of the pennies shined silver instead of copper so I looked into it. They were made during the war when copper was in high demand.
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"working on these old boats may not be cost effective but as it shows its what it brings into your life that matters" -Roger
1973 Skier |
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OverMyHead
Grand Poobah Joined: March-14-2008 Location: MN Status: Offline Points: 4861 |
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Mine usually costs me a pretty penny.
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For thousands of years men have felt the irresistible urge to go to sea, and many of them died. Things got better after they invented boats.
1987 Ski Nautique |
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eric lavine
Grand Poobah Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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Pete, does the UK fall under ACBS guidelines or is it basically an American thing?
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"the things you own will start to own you"
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eric lavine
Grand Poobah Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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Roger, I have no comments yet, other than a BBC would push that wood tug along nicely lol
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"the things you own will start to own you"
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Eric, The ACBS is international although most of the members are here in the states. |
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uk1979
Platinum Member Joined: June-13-2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1422 |
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Eric don't tempt me, Both are RH solid roller |
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Lets have a go
56 Starflite 77 SN 78 SN 80 BFN |
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uk1979
Platinum Member Joined: June-13-2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1422 |
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Don't worry Pete, all that is seen will be ACBS not so much the other |
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56 Starflite 77 SN 78 SN 80 BFN |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21169 |
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Roger, this is the first Ive heard of such an animal (reverse rotation roller cam for a BBC). Are you sure? |
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boat dr
Grand Poobah Joined: June-27-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 4245 |
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Tim, did you catch that ?
Both are RH solid roller Meaning they are not hydraulic....This is not only possible but probable...Twin engine go fast boats,ie Scarab, Cigarette... |
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uk1979
Platinum Member Joined: June-13-2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1422 |
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Tim this is what Crane sent me the one I have marked as HY should read TR, both are solid roller and they view rotation from the front of the engine, both are billet cams, down side have to run a chain and LH drive for Dis both are new old stock made in 90 and 91 they are a bit racy though.picked to 2 up for $150.00 so just took a punt on them
Would be good if you can confirm I have RH cams or a puppy. |
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Lets have a go
56 Starflite 77 SN 78 SN 80 BFN |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21169 |
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Ive never heard of or seen a reverse rotation roller BBC cam of any type, hydraulic or solid. Interesting!
That firing order (12756348) is indeed for a reverse rotation BBC. The lift looks to be out of this world... .708 at the valves! Thats a race cam if Ive ever seen one. For reference, my warmed up 351w has .490 at the valves, and my warmed up 454 will have ~.560 at the valves. This is a whole 'nother animal. I doubt you'd be able to make use of this cam in one of our boats, as its just too wild... but maybe it can be reground to something a bit tamer? Anyone know if theres any way to run hydraulic lifters with a solid cam? Maybe the ramp rate would be too agressive... what about if it were reground to something tamer? How do the metallurgy compare between the 2? I know the flat tappet vs. roller blanks wont allow you to mix and match, not sure how solid vs. hydraulic compare. |
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boat dr
Grand Poobah Joined: June-27-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 4245 |
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Did you by chance learn something Tim ? The cam card pretty much tells the story, don't you agree? As far as using a flat tappett on a hydraulic or vice versa is a sure way to wipe out a cam. Different ramp profiles are used on all three types of cam/lifter systems. Bottom line is do not mix components and expect a "happy cam"..........Boat dr |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21169 |
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Yup, learning something new every day. If you re-read above, you'll note my question was not whether you can mix and match flat tappet and roller cam components (I know thats a no-no due to the different hardnesses of the metals), but rather whether you can mix solid and hydraulic components. I realize ramp rates are usually different... but is there anything else precluding you from mixing the 2? IE, could Roger regrind that solid roller into something a little tamer and then use hydraulic roller lifters with it? My guess would be yes- but thats just a guess. Im assuming all roller blanks (be it solid or hydraulic) are of the harder billet steel variety... but again, thats just an assumption. |
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BuffaloBFN
Grand Poobah Joined: June-24-2007 Location: Gainesville,GA Status: Offline Points: 6094 |
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NOS huh...Roger, you're a dog!
Except that I learned a few things today too. Tim, how many places did you call? I found out that Crane has exactly one RH roller core left and it's for a gen 6. I found out a few other things as well, but whether they end up on the trivia pile or the app file remains to be seen. |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21169 |
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I called all the big outfits (Comp, Crane, Lunati) and a bunch of small ones that came highly recommended for BBC work- including at least one that specialized in high performance marine engines. None had any record that a reverse rotation roller ever existed, but we were talking Mark IV specifically. Pretty much all of them said they could grind it if I could source a blank though. I thought I struck gold when I found the flat tappet blanks... so I bought 2 extra! Sorry to hijack your thread Roger. |
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BuffaloBFN
Grand Poobah Joined: June-24-2007 Location: Gainesville,GA Status: Offline Points: 6094 |
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NOS means they're somewhere...unless the offshore guys got 'em all. I'll let you know what I find out.
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eric lavine
Grand Poobah Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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1.7 arms too
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"the things you own will start to own you"
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uk1979
Platinum Member Joined: June-13-2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1422 |
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Geg don't dismiss a gen 6 cam from what I found it will go in a gen 4 block you have to use gen 6 chain set and retainer, they say most gen 4 blocks have the screw holes for the retainer there just at the top and bottom not each side on a gen 6 worth checking out your sure to find a gen 6 RR roller cam. Gen 6 cam into Gen 4 |
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Lets have a go
56 Starflite 77 SN 78 SN 80 BFN |
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BuffaloBFN
Grand Poobah Joined: June-24-2007 Location: Gainesville,GA Status: Offline Points: 6094 |
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Don't mind me Roger. If anything, I'm jealous of all the fun you're having. That and Tim and I and I'm sure a few others have stacked up a few minutes researching this. The frustrating thing is a company's inventory seems to fluctuate in direct relation to the guy who answers the phone.
Here's a teaser for Tim...I e-mailed a guy about a reverse rotation hydraulic roller cam and his concern wasn't the rev roller; it was about matching my 'other' cam. Sounds promising? We'll see. |
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uk1979
Platinum Member Joined: June-13-2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1422 |
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Greg the question you need to ask the cam guys is who have you made RR roller cams for then call them,they won't be at the cam shops there sat on shelves in engine /race shops. thats were mine are from.
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Lets have a go
56 Starflite 77 SN 78 SN 80 BFN |
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uk1979
Platinum Member Joined: June-13-2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1422 |
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Lets have a go
56 Starflite 77 SN 78 SN 80 BFN |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21169 |
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Very interesting, Roger. I wonder who "Bob at RM" is. The only Bob I spoke to was at Marine Kinetics. I also spoke with Cam Motion and they couldnt point me in the right direction. He was really knowledgable but didnt know how to handle the cam snout. He made his own billet blanks but for whatever reason could not accomodate the gear/gear drive, and was not sure what my options would have been for the oil pump and dist gears if I were to convert to a chain timing set. It appears he has gained some knowledge since we last spoke... Very, very strange.
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uk1979
Platinum Member Joined: June-13-2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1422 |
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Tim,looks like these guys are making the cams just get them ro run 2 extra and bill the other guy
RR cam |
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56 Starflite 77 SN 78 SN 80 BFN |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21169 |
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Looking back at my notes, I believe I spoke with Kip at Cam Motion just over a year ago. A little more searching on Offshore revealed that Bob at Marine Kinetics goes by "RMBuilder" so Im betting that's who is grinding the cam for that guy. I spoke with Bob as well.
Looks like someone didnt ask the right questions because I was obviously talking to the right people... Im pretty sure we hit a dead end on the roller stuff because of technical hurdles. Maybe my memory is bad and cost was the issue? If Cam Motion charges as much as LSM for the blanks, then that might have been the case. |
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uk1979
Platinum Member Joined: June-13-2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1422 |
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Tim , may be worth a call to Bob the way I read the post he has a batch of 6 made so cost may have come down with the set up charges spread over 6, at best there may be 5 up for sale.
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Lets have a go
56 Starflite 77 SN 78 SN 80 BFN |
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