Ski 200 OB problem |
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WildH2OSkier
Newbie Joined: June-22-2011 Location: Central Alabama Status: Offline Points: 21 |
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There are no two items built on the same platform that are farther removed from each other than crotch rockets and Harley's. what I said was in jest and to prove a point. Two differently designed machines are going to handle differently. Also Nautiques are Competiton Ski Boats (sez so right on the stern of mine) so they are not supposed to be driven by people who cannot come to grips with their performance envelopes in comparison Maliboos and Disastercrafts.
Now is a good time for me to post this notification for all of you to read "95% of my bull*************** is pure bull***************...and I probably wouldn't listen to closely to the other 5% either) |
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Keeganino
Grand Poobah Joined: October-27-2009 Location: North Carolina Status: Offline Points: 2063 |
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Never seen such a bunch a poo flingin monkeys! Yikes This thread needs to be burried!
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"working on these old boats may not be cost effective but as it shows its what it brings into your life that matters" -Roger
1973 Skier |
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GottaSki
Grand Poobah Joined: April-21-2005 Location: NE CT Status: Offline Points: 3358 |
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Exactly, seeing how it took cc from 1925 to 1997 to finally make a smaller ski wake than then competition, this brand bashing is also getting nauseating.
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"There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing."
River Rat to Mole |
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Dieseldawg
Newbie Joined: August-23-2008 Location: Lilburn, Ga Status: Offline Points: 17 |
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I was surfing the ski-it-again site today and came across a post for a promo 200 OB. The picture in the add shows the boat at a low speed and the bow is very low in the water. I can only imagine how easy it would be to take on water over the bow, especially with additional passenger weight up front. I would also like to point out that over the bow water intake could all be avoided with proper driving technique. Also, if I did take water over the bow in calm water, I sure as heck would not repeat the same driving technique to make it happen again.<-----THINK ABOUT IT!
I have included a link to the 200 OB post to show the bow riding low in the water. http://www.ski-it-again.com/php/skiitagain.php?topic=Search&category=Comp_Boat&postid=15956 I was unable to make it to the Masters waterski tournament this year. However I did not notice any of the drivers struggling with water over the bow during the 2010 masters. All of the masters tow boats have three people on board in front of the pylon, but not in the bow. I wonder how many hours those drivers have under their belts? |
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02' Ski Nautique GT40 EFI
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Hollywood
Moderator Group Joined: February-04-2004 Location: Twin Lakes, WI Status: Offline Points: 13513 |
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Pete and Intel, you guys went too far with the name calling IMO. GottaSki also has a great point, CC was behind in wakes for a long time. |
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rckmann
Newbie Joined: July-02-2011 Location: Texas Status: Offline Points: 27 |
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My original post did not ask for driving advice, but all of you except Luchog were quick to accuse me of driver error, stupidity and inexperience followed by driving lessons. I was only trying to ascertain if it was only my boat or all 200 OBs that have the submarining problem. I especially find it very interesting that all of you are so knowledgeable, willing and able to give advice on a boat that it appears not one of you own and have little or no actual driving experience (with the 200 OB or CB). This Nautique is completely redesigned and unlike past Nautiques and while your driving techniques do work well on other boats, they don't on this boat, at least not mine. Also my boat was special ordered and handles quite differently than the OB & CB boats I demoed, even though some of you insist they are all identical. In fact, before they took my boat in for a coincidental "rudder port recall", while driving with no one in the bow and when coming to a stop the boat submarined more that a foot under water and continuing down as I was throttling down slowly as everyone here has so highly recommended and it was the continued forward thrust that caused the boat to continue downward. Had I not immediately jammed the throttle in reverse, my new boat would have definitely sunk. This happened time after time after time until they made a repair, which CC denies, obviously trying not to blemish the image of their new design. I can give the names of about 10 different passengers who were witness to this before and after CC's repair. I assure you that I have absolutely no trouble and am perfectly capable of driving my boat or any other boat without ever dunking the front end even into my own wake or any other wake, except with someone in the bow. Even after CC's initial repair, my 200 OB still submarines when people are in the bow. My only complaint is that CC sells and markets the 200 OB as a "family" competition ski boat because of the seating in the bow. The boat is great on the slalom course but, I'm sorry to say, that as a family boat it's absolutely useless. The bow area can only be used for relaxing while parked. If the bow seating is used while under way the passenger(s) in the bow get sprayed and often get soaked as the boat submarines when coming to a stop fast or slow. I only started this dialog after Greg Meloon, VP of Nautique product development refused to offer even a suggestion on what I might do to fix my boat even at my own expense. I told him I would pay for making a slight hull design change to the front of the boat so that the bow could be used safely and comfortably. I am very happy with the boat, but my wife is terrified to ride in the bow. The reason I purchased the open bow version was for my wife as she likes to ride in the bow. Obviously I don't ski on the slalom course with someone in the bow and even limit the number of passengers. I only hope this appeal gets to Nautique and that they offer to help me before my next round of publicity which I assure you will be much more resourceful and will hopefully reach perspective 200 OB buyers that might as I did believe Nautique and dealers who sell the open bow for actual use under way.
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Rick
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Hollywood
Moderator Group Joined: February-04-2004 Location: Twin Lakes, WI Status: Offline Points: 13513 |
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What prop is on the boat and do you keep the hydrogate up while cruising around with bow riders?
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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My initial responces like others, were trying to help but then when Rick didn't seem to be listening and started coming down on the CC design, I went into defense mode and yes, went too far. I apologize for that. |
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Hollywood
Moderator Group Joined: February-04-2004 Location: Twin Lakes, WI Status: Offline Points: 13513 |
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Buy me a few Coors Lights at the Goose Blind and I'll forgive you. Plenty of valid points were brought up, I'd be scared too if the bow kept going down. Anyone with 40 hrs of inboard driving knows it's a better alternitive to not to ride around with bow riders, but these boats are clearly advertised with them. I even took a small wave over my half of the windshield last night, 2 up front and 2 besides the engine. The lake was just rough!
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rckmann
Newbie Joined: July-02-2011 Location: Texas Status: Offline Points: 27 |
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I don't know what prop. It's what came with the boat. When cruising with or without bow passengers I put it in Cruise/Slalom mode as manual says- I believe that's up. That's a good point, but I've tried it both ways with similar results. Unless I put it in reverse just as the bow begins to pivot downward the bow goes down.
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Rick
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rckmann
Newbie Joined: July-02-2011 Location: Texas Status: Offline Points: 27 |
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I can't believe that with the supposed 10,000 Nautique 200's out there that none subscribe to this website. I really would like to talk to other 200 owners to see if it's only my boat.
If the driver of the Mastercraft that submarined was a better driver and/or not intoxicated he would have done as I did and slammed it in reverse thus avoiding his passengers from being swept up under the boat and cut up by the prop. If nothing else he should have at least taken it out of gear. They should try using that on their appeal to the $30 million verdict against them. |
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Rick
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bkhallpass
Grand Poobah Joined: March-29-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 4723 |
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Rick, Pretty sure there are less than 1000 of the 200s out there.
Jody Seal (FL Inboards) is a World level driver. He pulls the Moomba tournament in Australia, and other world events. He has both an open and closed bow 200. He also worked at CC for many years, and now makes his living repairing these boats. I would think he would be a good resource. Apparently he hasn't been on here much lately. You might want to send him an email. You should be able to find him in the directory or diaries. BKH |
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Livin' the Dream
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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It was one of my suggestions as well. I would have hoped Rick would try to get in touch with Jody but to date, it doesn't seem like he's taken any of our suggestions.
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quinner
Grand Poobah Joined: October-12-2005 Location: Unknown Status: Offline Points: 5828 |
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Hate to admit it but I actually agree with HW (lol) with regards to some reactions, from my perspective he is a person looking for help, perhaps a bit frustrated his very expensive ski boat is not performing as he had expected or hoped, perhaps not stating his case as graciously as he could have, however in the end Richey is just looking for some help.
I can tell you my 206 will submarine quite easily if you have even 1 person up front, with the 200 being 6" shorter it could be even more prone to it. Additionally my boat will handle like crap if not weighted evenly side to side as well. Until you figure it out (Call Jody), reserve the bow for your wife only while putting as many bodies in the back seat as you can to even things out more, this should make a big difference. |
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Luchog
Grand Poobah Joined: April-17-2007 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 2135 |
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I'm really glad the old gang has step up and showed some CCFAN help.
Rick, as others have mentioned, call Jody, he's a great guy and very knowledgeable. |
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SN206
Grand Poobah Joined: February-25-2009 Location: Fort Worth, TX Status: Offline Points: 2339 |
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Rick, where in Texas are you?
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...those who have fallen and those who will.
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east tx skier
Senior Member Joined: August-22-2006 Location: Tyler, TX Status: Offline Points: 248 |
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I'll second that. Where in Texas are you. If you're close, I would be very interested in seeing this first hand and seeing if I can help you figure out a solution. I don't have 4,000 hours at the helm, but I had a 93 MC 205 that would dunk the nose if you weren't careful.
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rckmann
Newbie Joined: July-02-2011 Location: Texas Status: Offline Points: 27 |
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I'm near Marble Falls. I'm going to talk to Jody as suggested. Thanks
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Rick
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east tx skier
Senior Member Joined: August-22-2006 Location: Tyler, TX Status: Offline Points: 248 |
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I'll be in Kingsland over Labor Day weekend if you want to meet up.
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rckmann
Newbie Joined: July-02-2011 Location: Texas Status: Offline Points: 27 |
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It's very nice of you to offer but I'll be in Virginia and then Florida returning Thurs or Fri after Labor Day.
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Rick
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WildH2OSkier
Newbie Joined: June-22-2011 Location: Central Alabama Status: Offline Points: 21 |
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Hmmmmmm I may be quite over reacting here but after reading where Hollywood quoted my statement I think I need to clarify it just a little more. I'm not a troll. When I say my bs is bs, its because I'm just happy go lucky person and don't sweat the small stuff. I hope the original poster in this thread has found the answer he was looking for. I should have never jumped in the way that I did and for that I apologize. I'll post some pics of the Ski Nautique of the Apocalypse as soon as I can get it cleaned up some. The pics of yalls boats have me well humbled and ashamed that I have let it get into such a neglected state. |
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'85 2001
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Hollywood
Moderator Group Joined: February-04-2004 Location: Twin Lakes, WI Status: Offline Points: 13513 |
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I enjoyed your comment and was laughing, that's all. My boat sounds similar to yours... |
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mdvalant
Grand Poobah Joined: May-06-2009 Location: Bellevue, IA Status: Offline Points: 2059 |
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Yea, didn't really read this till now. Kind of sounded like that other thread a couple days ago...but I think that dude was just in it for the fun and didn't even have a boat.
What's the status on the 200 OB? |
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mdvalant
Grand Poobah Joined: May-06-2009 Location: Bellevue, IA Status: Offline Points: 2059 |
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Tell you what, rode in a sport 200 for a demo day last saturday, with the v-drive, 6 guys in back and 2 in front the bow was dang low. Couldn't believe it.
Also felt like driving a stubby I/O with it being so short and wide. |
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MIskier
Senior Member Joined: July-29-2011 Location: Gulfcoast Status: Offline Points: 144 |
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To the OP even though many people have said the same thing that I will tell you, your driving style needs to change. Im a Naval Architect by training and have worked for one of the other big 3 mfgs, and regularly ski behind, and drive an OB 200. We can fit 2 100-120lb girls in the front and not dip the bow, you just have to watch what you are doing. The bow is very low to the water yes, but that should have been something that you would know from spending 4,000hrs at the helm of various boats...but apparently you dont. Please dont dump on the hard work of others just because you refuse to see that its your own technique and not some scandalous design flaw that the boat has.
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dmiracle
Senior Member Joined: July-22-2008 Location: Johns Creek, GA Status: Offline Points: 300 |
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If you pull into a driveway too fast in a Ferrari, you'll likely scrape the front air dam too. Big design flaw on those Ferrari's.
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Doug
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eric lavine
Grand Poobah Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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design flaw?
the one i really hate mir, is the ones that take a ride in a corvette and complain how rough they ride......its not a fcn Cadillac, or would it be reverse and go, i took a ride in a Cadillac and it rode to damn smooth lol good annalogy you got there |
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"the things you own will start to own you"
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Mojo
Grand Poobah Joined: December-06-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3106 |
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Who sold you the boat Rick? Sounds like you just "got sold"..
When I bought my first Ski Nautique open bow SNOB, man did I have to change my driving habits big time.. But hell, once I got good at dumping the nose, it was a great way to get the kids to stop fighting up front haha. That water coming over the bow was awesome.... OK, bad jokes, I know.. Hell even now my SV211 rides awefully low with three teens in the front, and they will get wet when the water isn't flat. (No jokes about GL guys ) Sure, they are certainly sold as more cross-over, family type boats now. But for the exception of maybe the 211 on up in size, they are still small ski boats that are used for what they were built for. In your case Rick, the 200OB just doesn't suit your overall needs.. It's the reason why so many of us have pontoon boats or some other boat to relax on, while the hard work is done by the real machine !!... I would be super pissed too, especially if someone didn't warn me of the possible problems when buying an expensive little boat and loading up the nose... Or maybe they didn't know at the time of the possible submarining problem, or that you planned on having someone up there all the time.. I would seriously look at selling it and buying something more suitable. Why boat with something you don't like. Life's too short dude.. Best of luck. Hope the rest of the summer goes better for ya.. Moj' |
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05' SV211 TE
73' Martinique had:96' SNOB had:76' Nautique had 77 Tique |
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dmiracle
Senior Member Joined: July-22-2008 Location: Johns Creek, GA Status: Offline Points: 300 |
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@ Eric - Did I mention that I really hate how sore my arms are after skiing behind my Nautique. The thing just pulls too damn hard.
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Doug
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rckmann
Newbie Joined: July-02-2011 Location: Texas Status: Offline Points: 27 |
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All your non-related analogies and experience are quite amusing. The fact still remains that Nautique promotes & sells the Ski 200 Open Bow as a competition boat for the whole family. IT'S NOT- PERIOD. It sucks as an open bow- IT SUBMARINES. And now I know why the Naval Architect is such an expert.
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Rick
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