Debt

Yeah a decade of "full employment" driven by unprecedented government spending (much of it Military spending) and an inflated housing/building market driven by rising prices caused by artifically and historically low interest rates and deregulation in the finacial securities industry. All while watching the infrastructure crumble around us..

For every salaried employee that is shaved off the bottom of the cream you see dozens of hourly manufacturing employees laid off based on nothing more than time on the job.. and that isnt making a company stronger.

I can only of course comment on what I have seen personally.. but that is what I have seen personally hundreds of Manufacturing jobs lost then. At the same time we didn't let go a single person out of the engineering group, a cpuple of support groups we didnt replace salaried employees that left but we didnt cut any chaft. This summer we have actually lost hourly employees to competing manufacturing operations that to me shows growth. Yes the growth has been slow.. but all the companies are flush with cash and the growth is sustainable.. and that is a real difference than the free fall of a couple years ago.

The other thing not taken into account in those numbers is the real and actually decline in public employment over this time frame.. so the reality is we have been reducing the real size of all government after it was seriously expanded under bush.   Personally I dont have a problem with many of the conservative philosophys I just dont see how putting republicans in office has ever actually gotten any of them implemented other than tax cuts which don't seem to promote any real growth or investment and because they were never paid for with reductions in spending are adding debt at an alarming rate.

I also cant have any faith in big corporations or the billionaires to run the country in the best interest of anyone other than themselves.. I am too close to the belly of the beast and I know that these guys are short sighted and barely able to look out for thier own best interest.   

The divide between the haves and have nots got narrowed by about two trillion dollars this week. I am sure the social justice crowd must be thrilled. Funny thing is the have nots are no better off, probably worse. We can at least see if taking money out of the hands of the rich changes their spending habits. My bet is if it lasts, less will trickle down and we will all be worse off.

OverMyHead wrote: ononewheel wrote:       It will be interesting to see how your argument fairs in the next two weeks, after the recalls.....he he he he he Are you still giggling?

Yeah, still giggling...albeit not as much. My sons just received a new wakeboard and that helps my giggling. Now I will be up tonight trying to figure out how to teach them how to use it and not watching an election.

Whomever it was that sparked that original comment,(I have not looked back), made it out that the Republicans were going to hold on to all seats.   The Dems took 2 Tuesday, 2 on the prior election, and there is still another election next week. So that it pretty good.
Glad the Republicans wee able to come off there ill gotten cash to support their candidates and send the cash to Wisconsin.

The important race they lost between Darling and Pasch, was pretty close especially considering the district history, Darlings 16 year history(more on that in a minute), and her large support network,READ Koch brothers.

Yea, Darlings 16 year history, all the republicans could follow the suggestions they say, some even in this very topic, about term limits. Funny how term limits only apply when they are convenient.

That just goes to show how valuable these seats are to them. It was estimated around 30 million was dumped into the campaigns. For what it is worth, I am sickened by both parties in this whole thing. How can a senate seat be worth this much? That was not a question, because we all know why.

I also think it will be lesson to the Dems who will fight for the recall of Walker. I cannot imagine the chaos that is going to bring to this state.

ononewheel wrote: Not sure I follow your logic.

I shoulod have been more clear, I was being a little sarcastic. The left loves to see the rich punished, and we lost two trillion in value off the stock market this week, So the gap has been narrowed betwen the rich and the poor (we know only the rich own stocks ). I am serious about it being a little lab experiment on trickle down economics if it lasts. I work for the rich, I work on homes valued up to 12 million dollars. When the rich are spending I work 50 hour weeks, when they are not I work 24 to 32 hours weeks. You can imagine how that affects what I spend, what I give, and what I pay in taxes. Trickle down economics does work, maybe not enough to narrow the gap between the rich and poor in a way that makes the left happy, but enough to seriously effect the low and middle classes.


On the recall, I am afraid we opened a huge can of worms and not just in Wisconsin. I have always seen the recall option as an extreme measure limiting the power of government, so we dont have politicians voting themselves kings with lifetime terms and unlimited power. Wisconsin has now said If you are elected by a majority and are doing what that majority asked you to do poltically (Kind of the whole point of our system) we will recall you for ideological reasons. Voter turnout was lower for the recall than it was in the 2010 elections, so a smaller pool of voters used the recall to over rule a larger pool, not to mention the expense and distraction that occured. The door is now open wide for this to be used by both sides. I am afraid it will make it even harder for our elected representatives to make the hard but correct decisions. Imagine if your kids could recall you because they were unhappy with their allowance or bed time. How would that effect how you run your household? Would that really be in your kids long term best interest? Minnesota has far higher hurdles for recall, and I think that is wise.

Dave, why should you sacrifice, you make it sound as if you dont work as hard as the rich folk, historically the rich feed off of the poor like sharks, you have a kind spot in your heart for them,
I dont get you sometimes, if we had a country full of Warren Buffets i would agree with your points, but most of the rich (like Madoff) swindled deals, shook hands to become rich, the rich dont blab, one of their handshakes could be a million dollar deal, but they sure the fck dont want to pay the tax on that milly...the rich are rich for a reason and its not from a hard days work

you think as how they want you to think

Eric, I believe in individualism, I dont judge a group by its worst members, ( what would I think of mechanics if this were the case) we have a criminal justice system based on fair trials, we have civil courts to monetarily compensate for wrong doing, again based on a fair trial, and we have a tax system to raise revenue to operate our government. I dont like to see these systems mixed, and I dont like it when on group is judged and sentenced to punishment, without a trial, by our tax code.

I am glad a real conservative canaidate is going to run. The texas governor, Rick Perry.

He will be the front runner

so where did the 2 trillion go from the last 10 days?

skicat2001 wrote: I am glad a real conservative canaidate is going to run. The texas governor, Rick Perry. He will be the front runner

Yep, right up your alley. A holly rolling science denier.

eric lavine wrote: clippin them for 35% sure as hell to me is not punishment, it just means that cant afford a 4th home

Eric, its all fine when it is someone else, especially someone you dont care for, but it sets the precident that they can do what they want. when they figure out there are not enough rich to pay the bills it will be you and I paying that 35%. Just watch.

phospher wrote: skicat2001 wrote: I am glad a real conservative canaidate is going to run. The texas governor, Rick Perry. He will be the front runner Yep, right up your alley. A holly rolling science denier.

A serious


I imgaine u fkers will vote for Obama the "Magnificent" again..

Aint that the truth

BuffaloBFN wrote: Newt looked sharp tonight.

I am not sure what to think of Newt. He has good ideas, and I was really pulling for him when he got in the race, but, when he threw Paul Ryan's budget plan under the bus a couple of months ago on one of the Sunday morning talk shows, that pretty much did it for me. It made me wonder if he would be a reliable conservative and be there when you really need him.

OverMyHead wrote: Eric, I believe in individualism, I dont judge a group by its worst members, ( what would I think of mechanics if this were the case) we have a criminal justice system based on fair trials, we have civil courts to monetarily compensate for wrong doing, again based on a fair trial, and we have a tax system to raise revenue to operate our government. I dont like to see these systems mixed, and I dont like it when on group is judged and sentenced to punishment, without a trial, by our tax code.

Such a moot point,    has it not been established the rich do not pay taxes proportionately to their income nor the lower income brackets.

Damn, it is just the opposite. The rich get to evade taxes with loopholes and havens, and never pay the price poorer folk do if they do not pay taxes

Do you realize you arguing against your own best interest, as well as your family and more than likely your friends too?