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Re Packing Rudder Port

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jimsport93 View Drop Down
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    Posted: September-16-2011 at 1:17pm
Hey guys. Was taking on water last weekend. Rudder may need tightening or re-packing. Going to pull the gas tank this weekend and check it out. Rudder does have a small amount of play when shaking it by hand. Have used the boat for five summers so far (approx 50 hours per season). So, think it is probably time. Could not find any other obvious signs of leaks (hoses, shaft log etc).
Could not find any good posts using the search feature on how to re-pack the rudder. Got some 3/16" packing on hand. Does it take the three piece wrap like you would do the drive shaft?
If anyone can direct me to a good previous post that would be great. Pics would help.
Got a '93 Sport BTW.
Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-16-2011 at 1:46pm
Jim, your boat fits solidly in the unabused catagory. I'd try tightening it in the water a little and then run it w/o the back floor and see what you get.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-16-2011 at 1:48pm
It's come up before, but I haven't seen any thorough details yet either. Watching this thread. The owners manual I have describes the drive shaft packing in detail, but then really just says the rudder is basically the same thing. Not super helpful.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-16-2011 at 1:58pm
Originally posted by BuffaloBFN BuffaloBFN wrote:

Jim, your boat fits solidly in the unabused catagory. I'd try tightening it in the water a little and then run it w/o the back floor and see what you get.

I agree with trying to tighten it first. Keep in mind that the rudder port can be tightened fairly tight since unlike the prop shaft, it's not constantly rotating.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jimsport93 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-16-2011 at 2:11pm
Pete and Greg, was planning on tightening it. But, also thought that since I was in there to go ahead and re-pack it. Boat is almost 20 years old and I am pretty sure the original PO never did it. Although, the boat has never sat overnight in the water very much (a few nights since I have owned it...probably never with the PO).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hollywood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-16-2011 at 2:13pm
I'm getting water through in our 88 after 10 years of never touching it. Pick up about 2-3 gallons over night. I plan on simply tightening it first.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ny_nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-16-2011 at 3:00pm
On my 84 SN tightening didn't work. I repacked with 3 layers of the goretex rope and it has made all the difference. Before, I could visibly see water sloshing in when not under power, and spraying in when moving. After, nice and dry.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jimsport93 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-19-2011 at 12:41am
Pete, not able to bust the packing nuts loose on the rudder port. Any suggestions?
If I am correct, the large top nut needs to go counterclockwise to loosen as the bottom, locking nut, needs to go clockwise. Does this sound correct?
Should I spray some PB Blaster on them?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-19-2011 at 2:30am
I'm not Pete...

Get a big pair of channel locks and put a rag in the jaw. Loosen the locknut first, and yes, looking down it goes clockwise.

You can get a regular wrench or a big adjustable. Both would maybe be more proper, but your card will wince.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-19-2011 at 9:01am
Jim,
Get the two wrench handles close to one another and squeeze. Usually you can get the leverage to break the two nuts. However, I have run accross some where somone had the same problem and resorted to the old center punch and hammer trick on the hex of the jam nut.

Forget the PB Blaster. In a previous thread the breaking torque figures were posted of various penetrating oils. PB came out almost as bacd as WD-40!! It's all marketing hype!!! The best was a home brew of 50% acetone and 50% ATF. Next was Kroil. I always have a can of Kroil around. Give the PB to your wife to use on the kitchen cabinet hinges!!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-19-2011 at 9:31pm
Jim, we're happy to have you drop by for breakfast and some wrench turning if you come up this way. Of course it won't leak much over the winter.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jimsport93 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-19-2011 at 9:55pm
Greg, thanks for the invite. Right now I would have to pull the boat up there on the trailer. Seats, floor and gas tank out. I did spray a little liquid wrench, that I had on hand, around the lock washer before I left this morning. Had not had a chance to wrench on her yet tonight (the boat I mean). I have several pretty large pipe wrenches. It is pretty hard to get good leverage in those tight quarters. Got some job related homework to do tonight, probably won't have a chance to give it a try till tomorrow night. Want to get it done though....not much lake time left this year.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-19-2011 at 10:08pm
Busy busy; us too. I still say a $20 pair of square jaw channel locks is the ticket. The pipe wrenches may scratch your nutz!    
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-19-2011 at 10:28pm

Greg,
You are a brass beaver chewing up the hex nuts too!!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-19-2011 at 10:33pm
Originally posted by BuffaloBFN BuffaloBFN wrote:

Get a big pair of channel locks and put a rag in the jaw.


Ha! Now you're on HW's watch list.   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-19-2011 at 10:37pm
It's been a long time since I scratched my brass...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-19-2011 at 10:45pm
Originally posted by BuffaloBFN BuffaloBFN wrote:

It's been a long time since I scratched my brass...

I'm going to need to consult Amy about this one!!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-19-2011 at 10:47pm
Guilty as charged.   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-20-2011 at 12:48pm
Maybe this will help, it looks like it has a square in the end, to add additional leverage with a ratchet or breaker bar:
http://www.skidim.com/prodinfo.asp?number=WRENCH
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cbr1000dude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-20-2011 at 2:15pm
Long ago I was cleaning out a car before it went to the wrecker (I was driving a tow truck at the time)and I found the biggest channel lock pliers I've ever seen. It's about 2 1/2 feet long, and can grip up yo about 6 inches wide. I thought, what would I ever need something this big for?
I almost chucked it. Since then it's saved my butt many times. That one and a smaller one (maybe 14 inches)busted my rudder and drive shaft lock nuts loose with no problem on a 24 year old SN that's had no maintenance I'm sure. You need a bigger wrench!
BTW, I don't care if my nuts are scratched!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jimsport93 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-20-2011 at 10:09pm
Well my nuts are loose Only slightly scratched.
Thinking that I should re-pack with fresh packing while I am in there.   Does the rudder take three seperate, staggered sections of packing like the drive shaft does? Know that I should support the rudder from underneath when disconnecting the tiller arm. Any other tricks or suggestions?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-20-2011 at 10:28pm
Good deal; and the $.38 question-what did you use?

I've seen several combinations of packing and the thin brass washer on rudders and shafts. Maybe someone can tell us both how they are supposed to be.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jimsport93 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-20-2011 at 10:40pm
Greg, sprayed some liquid wrench on locking nut Monday. Undid the tiller arm from the steering cable inorder to get a better angle. Used a pipe wrench, pulled and beat the end of the wrench with a hammer. It finally busted loose.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Keeganino Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-20-2011 at 11:38pm
When I packed mine i did as you described above, just like the shaft packing. 3 staggered layers of packing.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jimsport93 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2011 at 1:02am
Got it undone. Four rings of 3/16" packing. Thin brass washer on top of packing nut followed by a stainless washer and then the tiller arm. Getting all the old gunk cleaned off and ready to put it back together.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2011 at 1:07am
Do you have a camera handy? Not to be a PITA, but I'd like to see what a real one looks like all apart and ready to be assembled.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jimsport93 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2011 at 1:30am
Brian, yes, have a camera. Will take some pics. Probably tomorrow before I post them. About ready to call it a night. Got a big day riding with a corp human resources person tomorrow.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Salty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2011 at 3:10pm
Good luck with HR today Jim.   I am guessing they are filming a training video on how it is supposed to be done by the star?!!!   I may need to do a drive by and check on your rudder work since I need to do the very same with mine.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jimsport93 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2011 at 9:07pm
Dave, the ride with our HR person went well. Not sure about the "star" part. Mohawk is looking at ways to increase our productive selling time and make our life as a sales rep more efficient.
You are welcome to stop by any time. Got the rudder port re-packed and back together. Waiting on a new fuel guage sending unit for the gas tank before I put everything back together. Was in hopes of that part arriving today...not. Should be here tomorrow.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jimsport93 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2011 at 9:35pm
Brian, here are some pics:
Interior stern

Rudder port with packing nut and tiller arm removed

Packing nut repacked with fresh packing
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