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1978 Ski Nautique Restoration

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NeilMcG View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NeilMcG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: 1978 Ski Nautique Restoration
    Posted: April-06-2023 at 3:52pm
To stop creating thread after thread for every issue that comes up, I'm starting this one for everything related to this project

Brief history:
'78 Nautique w/351 RH restoration -2 years in.
It was in very bad shape including a fried engine. Got a block from an '80 and sent off for machining. It's a stock rebuild.
Installed new flooring and reinforced the stringers.
Re-upholstered w/new carpet.
All new gauges, including new wiring using bus bars up front. Dual GPS speedos as well.
If time permits, the outside will get a makeover too. Gelcoat, paint and 2k clear is ready to go. Even got a transom stencil made.

The pre-assembly checklist appears complete but one thing that wasn't considered was the circulating pump. What is the service life for this part and can a visual inspection tell you anything?
And what about an auto one?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 1980SN2001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-06-2023 at 5:17pm
I don't know what the expected service life on these are but I do believe it has to be a bidrectional unit due to your engine being reverse rotation. I ordered this one from Skidim.com for my 1980 Ski Nautique with the reverse rotation 351W.

1980 SN Project
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-07-2023 at 12:12pm
Here's a picture of the inside of one with the backing plate off. It's a bi rotational impeller in the picture

The bearings are usually the thing that gives out first and the cast impeller lasts a long, long time.

The bearings just last a long time Wink

You can spin it by hand to do a rough check of the condition of the bearings.

If it's smooth and not noisy, I'd probably reuse what you have if your budget is getting strained

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NeilMcG View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NeilMcG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-12-2023 at 6:59pm
WATER FUEL SEPARATOR

Inside the filter housing there is a spring wrapped around the center post. It is heavily corroded and while cleaning I noticed the spring is free floating. Is that the way it should be?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-13-2023 at 11:45am
How about a picture of this thing?
.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NeilMcG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-13-2023 at 2:11pm
Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:


How about a picture of this thing?
.

I've tried but have no clue how.
Where's Mr. Incredible when you need him?
I'll text a pic.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-13-2023 at 5:10pm
Pictures...............see the link and read the 2 posts on 2/7/23. I'm pretty sure you can handle it.Wink



It looks like your filter is the old Fram type that has a replaceable filter element and the spring keeps the filter element seated against it's sealing surface when everything is assembled. It prevents having any flow bypass the element.

I'd replace the whole thing with a filter kit like in the link below You get the adapter and filter You need to get a couple of hose barb fittings to screw into the adapter. Usually 1/4 inch pipe threads.


The linked one is a Sierra but there are plenty of other brands 

The whole filter and housing are one piece like the typical oil filter, so you unscrew the old one and screw the new one on. More convenient, less messy

Replacements are easy to find and most brands will fit the adapter threads.
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NeilMcG View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NeilMcG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-13-2023 at 7:14pm
Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:

I'd replace the whole thing with a filter kit like in the link below You get the adapter and filter You need to get a couple of hose barb fittings to screw into the adapter. Usually 1/4 inch pipe threads.


...and after I spent the evening cleaning and polishing it up 😂
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 63 Skier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-14-2023 at 9:17am
Did a '78 Nautique have a fuel filter/separator from the factory?  I was guessing it was probably added but not sure.
'63 American Skier - '98 Sport Nautique
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NeilMcG View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NeilMcG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-14-2023 at 9:53am
Originally posted by 63 Skier 63 Skier wrote:

Did a '78 Nautique have a fuel filter/separator from the factory?  I was guessing it was probably added but not sure.

I really don't know. But as it's the only filtering element , I assume it's original.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NeilMcG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-14-2023 at 12:16pm
SHAFT/ENGINE ALIGNMENT
I'm researching quite a bit on this subject; the ccfan youtube video is outstanding. The marina that pulled the engine cited an oddity with alignment, but couldn't recall exactly what it was when I was finally able to go retrieve the engine, so I expect a problem right off the bat. Any advice on what to what to look for, and how to address problems that arise?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-14-2023 at 9:49pm
Originally posted by NeilMcG NeilMcG wrote:

Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:

I'd replace the whole thing with a filter kit like in the link below You get the adapter and filter You need to get a couple of hose barb fittings to screw into the adapter. Usually 1/4 inch pipe threads.


...and after I spent the evening cleaning and polishing it up 😂

Well, nobody says you have to get a new one Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wayoutthere Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-15-2023 at 12:22am
Far as alignment goes, ron tanis has some very good videos on the subject.
Start fresh with new cutlas bearings in the strut.

Hopefully not but expect a bent shaft, or strut.

Alignment is critical but easy to achieve if you know the basics and all of the parts are in good order, and you got solid stringers.
I'll try to dig up a picture of the procedure.

Does the boat have new stringers ? Who put them in ?
All things being equal, the traditional alignment you read and watch videos about is just the accepted method, but alignment is alignment and there are other ways to achieve it.

Get some pictures up, there's great wealth of knowledge on this site and plenty of members who can advise you on any help you may need



https://youtu.be/UEqzJgCz_6w

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MrMcD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-15-2023 at 1:09am
My 1978 Ski Nautique had a fuel filter/water separator mounted passenger side of the engine down low on the stringer under the fuel pump.  I bought the boat in 1982 but assume it was factory stock.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NeilMcG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-15-2023 at 7:35am
Originally posted by wayoutthere wayoutthere wrote:

Alignment is critical but easy to achieve if you know the basics and all of the parts are in good order, and you got solid stringers.
I'll try to dig up a picture of the procedure.

Does the boat have new stringers ?

The stringers weren't replaced as they're in remarkably good shape; and I was actually unaware of any relationship between the two.
Quite surprisingly, the rot did not propogate throughout so it was easy to localize. I exposed the bad areas with pilot holes and poured a pmma acrylic solution in multiple stages until saturated with the fluid pooling at the top. Those areas now are hard as rock. I definitely dodged a bullet there.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MrMcD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-15-2023 at 12:53pm
I did the same in my 1987 Malibu, found small rot area under the engine mounts, drilled holes, first poured in a product bought at the lumber supply designed to kill rot, really stinky stuff.   Let that soak in to treat the old wood then filled it as you did with some type of recommended epoxy.   That area was still hard and good when I sold the boat 10 years later after hundreds more hours use.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NeilMcG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-15-2023 at 2:58pm
Originally posted by MrMcD MrMcD wrote:

I did the same in my 1987 Malibu, found small rot area under the engine mounts, drilled holes, first poured in a product bought at the lumber supply designed to kill rot, really stinky stuff.   Let that soak in to treat the old wood then filled it as you did with some type of recommended epoxy.   That area was still hard and good when I sold the boat 10 years later after hundreds more hours use.

I was thinking of using bigger lags for a greater purchase into the stringers. What are your thoughts on also filling the bores with epoxy putty and using 5200 under the brackets?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jonny Quest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-15-2023 at 3:21pm
Can you through-bolt it?  I prefer through-bolts to lags if possible  I would then bed the bolts in 3M 4200.

JQ
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NeilMcG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-15-2023 at 4:05pm
Originally posted by Jonny Quest Jonny Quest wrote:

Can you through-bolt it?  I prefer through-bolts to lags if possible  I would then bed the bolts in 3M 4200.

JQ
I agree 100% that thru-bolt is the best way to go, but I'd have to cut up sections of the floor and rip out foam for access and I'm running out of time...but perhaps I will.
I thought the only difference with 4200 was cure time. Is it a more friendly version too?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jonny Quest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-15-2023 at 4:19pm
5200 is bomb-proof.  Very difficult to remove.  4200 is less "permanent".  Still the same high-quality 3M below-the-waterline sealant, just not so stubborn if one needs to remove it. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-15-2023 at 7:16pm
Originally posted by NeilMcG NeilMcG wrote:

Originally posted by Jonny Quest Jonny Quest wrote:

Can you through-bolt it?  I prefer through-bolts to lags if possible  I would then bed the bolts in 3M 4200.

JQ
I agree 100% that thru-bolt is the best way to go, but I'd have to cut up sections of the floor and rip out foam for access and I'm running out of time...but perhaps I will.
I thought the only difference with 4200 was cure time. Is it a more friendly version too?

Since you have 8 mounting lag bolts that go vertically into the stringers (no cradle), it would be kinda tough to use through bolts without quite a major redesign of the stringers..


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NeilMcG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-15-2023 at 9:37pm
Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:


Since you have 8 mounting lag bolts that go vertically into the stringers (no cradle), it would be kinda tough to use through bolts without quite a major redesign of the stringers..


I was thinking a thru-bolt running horizontal in addition to the vertical lags.There's a pre-drilled hole at the bottom of the bracket that's center to the holes on the flange resting on the stringers, so a bolt could pass through without interference. The only thing it would need is a piece of flat bar on the outer side with a drilled hole for the bolt to pass through to distribute the load once tightened. But the stringers are now quite solid so it's ok. The only debate left is deciding what matrix to put in the bore holes...epoxy putty, peanut butter, 4200 etc.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MrMcD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-16-2023 at 3:05am
4200 is easier to work with after it hardens.  5200 is harder, in my thoughts stronger but a bugger to work with once hard.   Since I was able to remove my strut factory applied with 5200 I chose to stay with it and 5200 was applied when I re installed the strut.  Many use 4200 because it is more friendly to work with.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-16-2023 at 8:08am
Originally posted by NeilMcG NeilMcG wrote:

Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:


Since you have 8 mounting lag bolts that go vertically into the stringers (no cradle), it would be kinda tough to use through bolts without quite a major redesign of the stringers..


I was thinking a thru-bolt running horizontal in addition to the vertical lags.There's a pre-drilled hole at the bottom of the bracket that's center to the holes on the flange resting on the stringers, so a bolt could pass through without interference. The only thing it would need is a piece of flat bar on the outer side with a drilled hole for the bolt to pass through to distribute the load once tightened. But the stringers are now quite solid so it's ok. The only debate left is deciding what matrix to put in the bore holes...epoxy putty, peanut butter, 4200 etc.

Nobody's stopping you from putting 4 horizontal lag bolts in with your choice of sealer if you're so inclined.

CC was never so inclined though when they built it.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NeilMcG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-16-2023 at 11:25am
That's a relief.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote 63 Skier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-17-2023 at 12:00pm
I've long been surprised that the thrust from 240 and more HP inboard drives didn't wreak more havoc with lagged motor mounts.  I'd have thought that all that force forward, at the upward angle, would tend to work at the mounts more than it seems to in actual application.

Through bolted cradles seem like a good upgrade but then again all these boats, assuming decent stringer condition, seem to survive just fine with the oem mounts.  So I'd probably just do the same-old mounts over again.
'63 American Skier - '98 Sport Nautique
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NeilMcG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-22-2023 at 2:10pm
Originally posted by wayoutthere wayoutthere wrote:

Far as alignment goes, ron tanis has some very good videos on the subject.
Start fresh with new cutlas bearings in the strut.

What's your opinion regarding installing a new coupler?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-22-2023 at 7:11pm
Originally posted by NeilMcG NeilMcG wrote:

Originally posted by wayoutthere wayoutthere wrote:

Far as alignment goes, ron tanis has some very good videos on the subject.
Start fresh with new cutlas bearings in the strut.

What's your opinion regarding installing a new coupler?

Only if you think or know the old one is bad, unless you're just kinda sadistic and enjoy doing miserable jobs, that may or may not go right  Wink


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NeilMcG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-22-2023 at 7:35pm


Only if you think or know the old one is bad, unless you're just kinda sadistic and enjoy doing miserable jobs, that may or may not go right  Wink



How does one know it's bad? I'm already in recovery for sadism, and the romance of tackling miserable jobs is diminishing by the hour.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MrMcD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-22-2023 at 7:44pm
If the old one was tight as hell it is probably perfect.  If you got it off with no problem the center hole is loosening up and it is shot.   There is probably a spec you can measure with a Mic to verify but tight on removal is good.
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