351 W stops after being shut off wont start |
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Moody Blue
Groupie Joined: July-24-2015 Location: indianapolis,In Status: Offline Points: 78 |
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I was not able to water test the Martinique when I purchased it. There were a couple of things that I missed but overall, I think it's a good boat. Stringer are original and I'm not sure of their condition.
This boat originally had a Holman Moody 302. It reportedly froze and cracked. PO purchased the boat and installed a mid 80's rebuilt 351W. Also did interior. I do realize that heat should not affect a restart but the boat will fire up when it has a chance to cool. Figured it couldn't hurt to actively pull the heat and enjoy the boat while I diagnose. I have an old school boat mechanic who I've spoken with quite a bit who has made made many suggestions. I'll probably get it to him in the spring first thing. As for pulling from the lift ring, I cringe when I hear people say they do that. I have owned an 18' Chris Craft Cavalier for 13 years (zero issues!) and retro fitted a steel plate across stringers to accept a heavy duty tripod pylon (no tubes on this pylon). The Martinique came with a heavy solid steel finger eye pole but the diameter is too big for the receiver. The plate across the stringers is gone. The pole is beautiful and I have an install plan! I love the stories in Diaries. I'll add to. Again, thanks for the welcome. |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Richard,
Do you know the 351 engine rotation that was installed? Hopefully it's a RR. If you're not sure, a good indicator is looking at the prop. A RR should turn clockwise for the forward direction looking at it from the aft. In the maintenance section, there's a FAQ thread. If you haven't already, take a look at it since there are links to fantastic threads for almost anything you need to know. If not, you know there are plenty of members who can answer questions. Do take a look at checking stringers as well as alignment. In 72, I'm pretty sure (Tim will know for sure) that the pylon had a square base welded to it for bolting to the sole and then the bottom fit into a cup that is glassed into the hull at the keel. Your hull may already have the cup. Take a look. On the underside of the sole, there should be wood spanning the main stringers for reinforcement. Do you know what the PO did with the H/M? Being such an original type, I was disappointed to hear of the repower. However, he did put a good engine back in. |
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JoeinNY
Grand Poobah Joined: October-19-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5698 |
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Nice looking boat, most likely culprit to your no start would be a dripping carb flooding out the engine, after float bowl is empty and the gas evaporates it starts again. Of course it could be electrical as well, best way to check is to have a timing light with you to check for spark next time y0u get the no start condition. If it shows a spark then investigate the fuel system if it has no spark then its time to look at the ignition system. Until then just wait it out... removing the heat from the box through a fresh air blower is not a fix for anything, if your cooling system is working correctly you can remove more heat from that engine with the unlimited amount of cool water available than you could ever remove by blowing cold air across the outside of the motor.
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Moody Blue
Groupie Joined: July-24-2015 Location: indianapolis,In Status: Offline Points: 78 |
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It is a right rotation with a 4 blade prop. I have no idea what became of the Holman Moody 302.
From photos of other Correct Craft pylons, I see the spanning plate between stringers. Mine has been cut out. Looks to have been wood with steel. My pylon diameter and shape does not match the receiver glassed into the hull. I'm thinking of a steel plate with a center pylon hole to span stringers and a steel tube cuff to slip over the receiver and pin through the securing hole. Insert the pylon through the stringer plate, into the cuff and secure it with a pin. I'll see what I can determine on stringer condition. |
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Moody Blue
Groupie Joined: July-24-2015 Location: indianapolis,In Status: Offline Points: 78 |
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Hi Joe
I know you are absolutely right. Wish it were the beginning of the season. I'm anxiously awaiting spring! Meanwhile, I'm staying happy taking care of cosmetic and other minor issues. |
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SNobsessed
Grand Poobah Joined: October-21-2007 Location: IA Status: Offline Points: 7102 |
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Might want to use stainless steel.
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“Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.”
Ben Franklin |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Richard,
How about posting a picture of the pylon you have. Personally, to aid rigidity, I would avoid an adapter which adds another connection point unless this cuff is firmly attached to the pylon. |
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Moody Blue
Groupie Joined: July-24-2015 Location: indianapolis,In Status: Offline Points: 78 |
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True happiness will be resolving the hot start issue!!
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backfoot100
Platinum Member Joined: January-03-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1897 |
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I agree with Joe. 5-10 minutes will not make a difference in how much the engine cools. Next time remove the flame arrestor even before you shut it down and look down the throat of the carb immediately thereafter. Gas dripping will cause your problem or there is another electrical issue. Component heat (like a hot coil) could be a factor but ambient heat is not your issue. We need more info after you get a chance to investigate a little more. |
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When people run down to the lake to see what's making that noise, you've succeeded.
Eddie |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21169 |
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Agree with joe and Eddie. You're doing more harm than good by pumping the throttle if the carb is drippy. That is by far the most common culprit to the "poor hot starting" issue... Temp actually does not play a role in that case. Do as joe says and do some testing.
Post a pic of the pylon. There would not have been any metal reinforcement in the floor or stringers prior to the aluminum engine cradles that started on some models in 1980. The pylons with the square through bolted flange didn't start until '76. Prior to that, they relied on the cup in the hull and the pass through the floor (or wood member just below it). It would help to see what you're working with before you devise a plan. |
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Moody Blue
Groupie Joined: July-24-2015 Location: indianapolis,In Status: Offline Points: 78 |
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Thanks everyone. Truly appreciate your knowledge and input. Can't do much with her until spring. Close look at carb will be first thing.
I've been trying to post more pics but it seems to be hit or miss. Feel like I was lucky to get the earlier ones posted. |
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Moody Blue
Groupie Joined: July-24-2015 Location: indianapolis,In Status: Offline Points: 78 |
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/Users/jannettehogshire/Desktop/IMG_2118.JPG/Users/jannettehogshire/Desktop/IMG_2119.JPG
This is the pylon. Beautiful piece but not what i've seen as factory equipment and not sized to fit my factory receiver. OD is similar to OD of receiver in hull. I"m thinking that the attached bracket shown in pic will come off and not be used. Pole and new stainless stringer plate would be welded to become one unit. Cuff welded to bottom of pylon to fit down over receiver and pin secure. |
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Moody Blue
Groupie Joined: July-24-2015 Location: indianapolis,In Status: Offline Points: 78 |
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oops. wrong way to post pics!
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Richard,
Use the "post reply" and not the "quick reply". Click on the icon of the tree with the up arrow. A box will come up allowing you to select the picture off your computer. |
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phillipsrj
Newbie Joined: October-10-2015 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 39 |
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It seemed that when I was having the problems (which I have not fully solved yet) That the Blower was not reducing the heat but taking the extra output from the alternator and thus lowering the volts to the ignition system?
Commodore Bob |
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Commodore Bob.
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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You haven't done the recommended testing!!
Bob, How about starting over and reading this complete thread (from the top of page #1)? It seems that you are not following any of our suggestions. In THIS thread:
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Moody Blue
Groupie Joined: July-24-2015 Location: indianapolis,In Status: Offline Points: 78 |
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Hi Peter
Yes, I use the "post reply" button and the tree with arrow icon. I choose my photo, hit OK to allow it to upload but then get the message "You have already selected a file with this name. Please select another file or rename". At that point, I'm not sure how to do that. I've been able to get the photos in my file manager. I've been using my iPad and was able to get the two pics of the boat posted. Tried my main computer also. Everything flows until I get the roadblock message. I'll keep at it. |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Richard,
I've run into the same problem when a picture is already in my file manage. I don't know if it's the correct way to handle it but I've just gone into my computer and changed to name of the picture. I'm sure there's another way and someone I'm sure will come along and give some advice. |
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Bri892001
Grand Poobah Joined: September-27-2008 Location: Boston MA Status: Offline Points: 4947 |
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Are you able to get to the photos on your file manager? If so, I've got an easy fix.
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Bri892001
Grand Poobah Joined: September-27-2008 Location: Boston MA Status: Offline Points: 4947 |
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1.) Towards the upper left, click on "Member Control Panel" with the little picture of the gear.
2.) When you get to that screen, click on File manager. It will take a few seconds to switch to that tab 3.) Find the photo you want, highlight and do a single click. You'll then get a preview. And a link with the file name. This link is the moneymaker. 4.) In my case, I've got one called Carb_005.jpg. Now, knowing this alone isn't helpful, but if I click on the link Carb_005.JPG I'll go to a brand new page with the full address in the address bar: http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/uploads/6518/Carb_005.JPG 5.) Copy this address, now paste it in between these tags: {img}http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/uploads/6518/Carb_005.JPG{/img} 6.) Now, I used squiggle brackets for demonstration purposes. Those won't work. Just changes all your { to [ and your } to ] and you should have the picture directly posted. 7.) Por ejemplo: |
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phillipsrj
Newbie Joined: October-10-2015 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 39 |
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OK C R OW for dinner the boat started and ran with the 12v 3olm coil with resistor but would not go over 3200 rpm's.
Back to the dock I pulled off the spark arrestor and saw fuel dripping from the primary on the starboard side of the carb. Now What.? Rebuild the carb? I put the old coil back on but did not have time to test before the rains came. Commodore Bob PS: I have to trailer my boat 22 miles to the lake. |
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Commodore Bob.
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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phillipsrj
Newbie Joined: October-10-2015 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 39 |
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I am thinking that I need to find a re-build kit. I see on a forum that the carb # is by the Choke?
Commodore Bob |
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Commodore Bob.
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Just in case you can't find the banner at the top of the page - site sponsor |
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lewy2001
Grand Poobah Joined: March-19-2008 Location: NSW Australia Status: Offline Points: 2234 |
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Yes pumping the throttle is just adding to the "flooded" condition (i.e. excess fuel in the inlet manifold and combustion chamber). Every time you pump the throttle the accelerator pump squirts more fuel into the inlet manifold. Before fuel injected cars we learnt to remedy the "flooded" condition by holding the foot to the floor (throttle plate wide open) while cranking the engine to clear. |
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If you're going through hell, keep going
89 Ski <a href="http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5685" ta |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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And the reason I told Bob this in the 3rd post!!!!
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Moody Blue
Groupie Joined: July-24-2015 Location: indianapolis,In Status: Offline Points: 78 |
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Moody Blue
Groupie Joined: July-24-2015 Location: indianapolis,In Status: Offline Points: 78 |
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Brian, thank you! That worked.
This is the pylon. The OD iOS greater than the ID of the receiver in the hull. Utilizing the receiver with a joining cuff and a stainless plate spanning stringers should be rock solid. |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Richard,
I don't feel that pylon you have will work for your boat. The CC's pylons are a larger diameter giving it the strength needed to be supported at the keel and then at the sole. Note on your pylon there's a support which originally would have been fastened to a deck bulkhead running port to starboard giving it the needed support close to the ring and finger. Take a look at the diary's and brochures to see the larger diameter CC used. Your's will bend and could be a big problem. |
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Moody Blue
Groupie Joined: July-24-2015 Location: indianapolis,In Status: Offline Points: 78 |
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Gotcha. I wasn't sure where that support bracket was originally. I can see that pole bending too. It seems substantial but I know what kind of pull a skier puts on it, not to mention a tube. We tubed solely behind wave runners. I'm thankful for your input because I was full steam ahead on the project. Are CC poles tough to come by?
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