And so it begins...

I also spoke to CR at the time, it would have to of been a major malfunction...
lets try the fuel thing first

Chris,
Eric would know the answers to your questions he put it together for me.

My concern is the lean condition the plugs are showing. I was doing some research on the carb and came across a video put out by Holley.
It talked about the power valve in the new carbs having a blow out protection (92 & newer) to protect it from backfires.

I'm wondering that when I first ran it with the two wires switched, if I could have blown the pwr/valve with all the backfires.

They are definitely burning too lean. Before I dig into the cam theory, I think I’m going to try some carburetor things first and see where that gets me.
Tonight when I get home I’ll try to see what jets are in there and also pull the power valve. My local auto parts has some pwr/valves and jets in stock so I can start there. Hopefully either Friday or Saturday I can get some test runs on the changes.
After that if I don't see any change or don't like the results, then I'll persue the cam lift ideas.

PS: The motor does still have the stock ignition system...points/condenser if that information will help.

Bare with me on this as I’m just learning this technical stuff. But isn’t the fuel/air already mixed when it gets to the valves.

The valves are there to allow X-amount of the mixture in/out of the cylinder. So wouldn't it already be lean before getting there?

Now I could see that if the valves aren’t opening enough due to shorter push rods, then you would be robbing yourself of the full potential of the larger valve/valve openings.

nope, if i remember correctly i used the gauge and they are right where they are suppose to be. i do remember i had the next size rod and it was to much. didnt blue them because they were rollers. if there burning white, they're getting air, we would definitly have a rich situation if not..

Correct way to determind push rod length when using stud mount roller rockers

eric lavine wrote: nope, if i remember correctly i used the gauge and they are right where they are suppose to be. i do remember i had the next size rod and it was to much. didnt blue them because they were rollers. if there burning white, they're getting air, we would definitly have a rich situation if not..

well I'm very worried, if you just stuck that push-rod gauge in and used it as is, and you based the length off of that without adjusting the length of the push-rod gauge, or reading the length it was set at and then compared it to something laying around to determind the length, then you did more harm than good and that motor will never last and you need to stick to transmissions only.

and let me take another shot in the dark and I bet the heads where not ported either to match up with the intake and exhaust? oh well spend all that money to get the heads right then fall short on the details and leave power on the table

GottaSki wrote: gun-driver wrote: I pulled a plug and its white as could be. A white ceramic alone does not mean you are too lean. The plug tips are supposed to be white. Compustion temps are supposed to be high enough so the plug tips self-clean. You could very well be just right. There is a method to jetting, and you do not have the essential information to go ripping into the carb yet. Run it WOT on just the primaries then cut open a plug. Then add the secondaries then cut open another plug. Measure the soot ring width on the base of the insulator on each. BTW, contrary to some advice given, changing the power valve to another number does nothing to volume of fuel above 32 mph or so. And if you go jetting on tip color your wasting perfectly good time.

According to Holley the power valve supplies additional fuel for under heavy load and full power situations.
Also according to Holley to check for proper jetting Your supposed to drive your vehicle at the rpm range that you what to check then turn off the ignition so that you get the true reading for that range and you check the insulator tip for the light tan color

I have always been under the impression that the insulator tip was supposed to be light tan. That comes from my days of motocross and snowmobile jetting.

I mentioned the power valve might be blown out from the backfiring it was doing when I had the two wires mixed up. And that idea came straight from a Holley video.
I am going to look and see if it’s the right power valve for it since the head and intake changes, once I put a vacuum gauge on it.
And I figured it won’t hurt to try a different jet size and see what happens.

Gun driver,
Gotta-ski knows Holleys.
This is what I know. The right P/V will optimize the acceleration when you nail the gas. to keep a ski boat from stumbling a higher # is generally better (4-6.5) something like that it's a tweeking thing for the future. If you think it's blown at least put a known good one in and press on.
The engine I have in my boat now is a rebuild I got, then made it my own. Stealth intake, GT 40p heads with a couple hr.s porting, 1.7 Ford Cobra roller rockers Elec. ignition, Cam Reasearch cam, 540 prop ect..
I put a New holley 4160 on it from Summit but changed the P/V to 6.5 and changed the jets from 66 (stock) to 68's. I also dialed in the choke stat and I'm still fooling with the idle mixture screws.
With 10 ish hrs. it runs very well, but there's still more on the table and I'll keep messing with it.
Hope this helps. My work e-mail is andrew.owsiak@navy.mil shoot me your phone # if you want, always glad to b.s. with a CCFan    

and btw, when someone says put these heads on, this cam in thats what i get paid to do, but on the other hand if one is told all you have to do is slap these heads on and you'll get 50 out of the boat....maybe thats where the problem originates??????????

Just thought I would let you know that I checked out my top speed and with my PCM 330 and the 442 4 blade I was hitting 48 at 5100 rpms.

gotta is on point with the tips, if you re-cam and only re-cam, you'll be lucky to see a couple mph's and you might kill the holeshot,
personally I would get a set of jets, a PV because you dont know the condition, go down to the lake on an early morning and do some runs, put in the 6.5 and go up 2 on the jets and do comps, if you pick up 100 rpm go up another size, if not and you start smelling gas, back off on the jets...these are the simple things first.
make sure the boat is propped correctly,
I believe you are also still running a points ignition, thats a cheap easy out of the box upgrade, Mallory.
you just got the boat running and you need to dial it in,
as you say it runs like a raped ape and these guys are getting the impression that the boat is falling off of a cliff,
I think its performing to its potential, but needs some tweeking, a little more gas and a hotter spark does wonders. if i remember correctly i put chromes in there and they need a good 12 hours to take shape.
to hit the 50 mark i think you'll need some domes in there, a hotter cam and so on....but that 50 mark has a price not only on the pocket book but on reliabilty....50 is the point where things will start to break and the boat will sit. im sure some may comment on the 50 mark as to the reliability aspect.
were not going to hit 50 merely by a cam change....
and my challenge is if someone steps up and tells you yes it will hit 50 with a half inch of lift, i will swap the cam at no cost to you if it doesnt then we will let them pay the labor   lol

Eye ball, are you doing this as it moves or when it's closed, piss poor lazy way out it looks center so it should be centered, doesn't work that way sorry half assed IMHO.

When you spoke with CR did you mention the increased compression, doubt it, doubt you even CC'd the heads to know what you had and why you have a 302 cam.

Explained very clearly the heads needed ported, never recommended any cam or it would reach any speed,

Again you are one hundered percent correct you did what was asked and nothing more nothing less, no questions or suggestions, only your thought it wasn't reliable to try and reach x speed since it's just a ski boat.

Fuel and Spark isn't going to correct poor valve train geometry or poor cam specifications, but then maybe the right questions wheren't asked or enough information wasn't given so it could be, compression ratio, intake, exhaust sizes, spring rate, or lift, the heads are not stock in raw form or for the year motor or boat, thats why more detail and care has to be taken.


it just reminds me of another situation where expectations where not meet or satisfaction deliveried, you pay for this you get this. It's like the guy running the club house at the golf course here locally he runs eveyone out of the bar and wonders why his business keeps falling off. And I just went oh no, no you didn't and hung my head in disgust privately when I found out.

I'm not being snippy, just disappointed the full potential of the parts bolted on are not being used as intended, due to a lack of understanding of proper installation and proper component matching the requirements needed for the parts being installed,

to me it's cop out to a degree, one unknowing and trusting the mechanic to know and who I feel the worse for, the other making excuses, it's a flat tap, there's a plateau, they say it's good, I only do what is asked and the problem is the song and dance someone sold you, which are all false and all excuses and nothing more.

But hey it sure looks good, other than not sure about the intake, hard to see in the pictures.


But it's like Indy car racing they all have the same chassies, same engine and same tires from the same manufacturers yet some are very fast and some a lot slower than the others. So it boils down to what then if all is the same they should all run the same other than the one variable that is all ways over looked, who's putting it together, who's tuning it, and that is all the difference there is.