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oil type and weight ? |
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eric lavine 
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Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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 Posted: September-25-2009 at 10:28am |
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I use it strictly for break in, after that i really personally do not think it matters, if oil levels are sufficient and heavy viscosity, and bonding of the oils to the surface is what counts. the lifter does not really ride metal to metal, it realies on a thin layer of oil between the surfaces. thats what i was taught and just passing info, but for the record ive been changing the oil on the same boats for the past 15 years and surely dont drop 5 bucks a qaurt into them and to this day i havnt seen a cam failure due to lack of Zinc. the only time i see cam failures is on break in and thats the reason i stick with the zinc because in this case until the lifter gets its shape i use it
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"the things you own will start to own you"
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Hollywood
Moderator Group 
Joined: February-04-2004 Location: Twin Lakes, WI Status: Offline Points: 13514 |
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Posted: September-25-2009 at 5:02pm |
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How many years has it been since the ZDDP has been lowered in conventional oils? How many of your customers only need 1 or 2 oil changes a year? Like it was said on the first page, it may take a while. I'm thinking there are a lot of LUCKY cams out there right now, but the clock is ticking.
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scottb
Senior Member 
Joined: July-05-2006 Location: Bolingbrook, IL Status: Offline Points: 376 |
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Posted: September-25-2009 at 6:14pm |
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Hey, I made the Hollywood signature line. Now I'm famous ... or maybe just infamous.
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skutsch
Grand Poobah
Joined: June-19-2008 Location: Racine, WI Status: Offline Points: 2874 |
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Posted: September-25-2009 at 6:26pm |
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Ok, guys the last time this was discussed, I got all worked up and did a ton of cruising on the net, trying to figure out the real deal. Eventually I found my way to StevesNovaSite.com. There is a guy on there, username "Veno" who not only researched the ZDDP content but also researched the best testing methods. No offense MrHemi, but the testing methods are as important as the actual results themselves. There are very few labs that have the appropriate equipment to complete the correct tests. Anyway, if you want to read the 23 page thread it is posted here:
http://www.stevesnovasite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=80715&highlight=zddp Its actually a good read and you learn a lot about this issue and you will start to understand some of the myths that are out there. I recommend it, if you have nothing to do for a few hours. Also note he begins the thread in 2007 but finishes his research sometime in early 2009, so the data is actually current. That is the problem I found with some of the stuff I found it was 2 or 3 years old, and the EPA requirements have changed. The summary of his findings are below or click here: http://www.stevesnovasite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=88262&highlight=zinc Oils suitable for breakin……..that are available. with enough Zinc and Phophorus.. OILS LISTED BY ALPHABETICAL ORDER NOT BY QUALITY or quantity of content. Brad penn break in oil grp2 Joe Gibbs break in oil grp2 Pennzoil GT performance. All weights. grp2 Shell Rotela T 30wt, 40wt, 15W40wt. grp2 Starbright 30Wt grp2 Starbright 40Wt (pending) grp2 Valvoline VR1.. all weights grp2 OILS suitable for street High performance use with enough Zinc and Phosphorus for flat cams and High spring rates. Up to 150lbs seat pressure. Brad Penn all weights grp2 Castrol GT 20W50 for older cars grp?? Champion XPS 20W50 grp3 syn Joe Gibbs oils grp?? Mobil1 15W50 gold cap and silver cap. grp4 syn Mobil1 Turbo diesel truck grp4 syn Mogil1 racing grp4 syn Pennzoil GT 25W50 grp2 Royal Purple racing oils syn Shell Rotela T 30wt, 40wt, 15W40wt. grp2 Quaker State Q horse power 10w60 only grp 3 syn Valvoline VR1 all weights grp2 TRACK/RACE only. Brad Penn all weights grp2 Champion XPS 20W50 grp3 syn. Joe Gibbs oils grp?? Mobil1 racing grp4 syn Pennzoil GT all weights grp2 Royal Purple racing oil all weights grp4 syn Quaker State Q RACING all weights…syn Valvoline VR1 all weights grp2 Valvoline synthetic racing all weights grp? Valvoline conventional NSL all weights grp2 Pour on top additives to boost zinc. Listed in order of zinc content ZDDPLUS. GM EOS. CRANE CAMS BREAK IN, COMP CAMS BREAK IN Some of these oils, I actually summarized in a chart and posted earlier, but I can't find it neither on my computer nor the old thread. |
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eric lavine
Grand Poobah
Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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Posted: September-26-2009 at 8:43am |
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Hollywood, interestingly enough if you closely look at a flat tappet cam and lifter they dont run directly on the center of the lobe, they ride on the side. as the cam turns it swipes the lifter causing the lifter to turn in the bore. its not metal to metal sliding against eachother. I had this problem with the 460 i just did and had to buy a new cam, one of the lifters was stuck in the bore and wouldnt rotate, it took about a half hour to wipe it.
you know i go by statistics, I pulled 2 engines down this week a sbc and a bbc, the cams are going right back in because they look factory new...they are high hour poker run engines, 2 speeds stop and full power with normal engine oil changes with non zinc oils. i niether condone or condemn using the ZDDP and stated on break in I do and after that ???? i cant say you need But I cant say you dont. merely observations and from what i know and see if i was an oil company and knowing the American consumer, if they removed the zinc they put some other type of additive to compensate to avoid liabilty and I dont really think every guy on this site is running VR1, or we surely would be reading alot more about cam failures. as for now i will keep running Zinc on break in, after that... |
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"the things you own will start to own you"
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eric lavine
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Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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Posted: September-26-2009 at 8:49am |
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HW, now if the discussion was about foam and rot, we could go on for days lol
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"the things you own will start to own you"
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Hollywood
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Joined: February-04-2004 Location: Twin Lakes, WI Status: Offline Points: 13514 |
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Posted: September-28-2009 at 4:28pm |
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We've beaten the foam horse more that quinner beats his meat.
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eric lavine
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Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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Posted: September-29-2009 at 10:08am |
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you think he ever got caught?
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"the things you own will start to own you"
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